[00:00:00] Welcome. I'm Erik Fleming, host of a Moment with Erik Fleming, the podcast of our time.
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[00:01:24] Hello, and welcome to the Moment with Erik Fleming. I am your host Erik Fleming.
[00:01:39] And I hope that you are enjoying your Memorial Day weekend, at least a conclusion of it.
[00:01:49] And I hope that you remember the reason why we have this holiday.
[00:01:57] And I am honored that you are listening to the podcast. Glad that you could join us.
[00:02:04] Got a great guest lined up for you.
[00:02:08] Then I've got some thoughts in the second half of the podcast that I hope you enjoy.
[00:02:18] And I'll listen to and appreciate.
[00:02:21] All right, having done all that, it's time to kick it off.
[00:02:24] And we're going to start it with a moment of news. We grace G.
[00:02:34] Thanks, Erik. District Attorney, Fanny Willis and Judge Scott McAfee, key figures in the Trump election interference case,
[00:02:44] easily won their respective Georgia primary races.
[00:02:48] The city of U.V. Texas has agreed to a $2 million settlement with families of the victims of the 2022 Rob Elementary School mass shooting.
[00:02:57] Donald Trump chose not to testify in his criminal hush money trial.
[00:03:02] An ethics complaint against Justice Juan Mershon overseeing Trump's hush money case was dismissed by the New York State Commission on judicial conduct.
[00:03:11] President Joe Biden urged Morehouse College graduates to uphold democracy,
[00:03:16] while addressing their concerns about the Gaza war and emphasizing the fight against racism.
[00:03:21] Iranian President Ibrahim Reyesi died in a helicopter crash near the Azerbaijan border.
[00:03:27] Texas Governor Greg Abbott granted a full pardon to a former Army Sergeant convicted of murder for shooting Garrett Foster, a Black Lives Matter Protester.
[00:03:37] FDIC chair Martin Groonberg announced his resignation, a made a scandal involving sexual harassment and other misconduct.
[00:03:46] David DePape was sentenced to 30 years in prison for breaking into former Speaker Nancy Pelosi's home and assaulting her husband.
[00:03:54] John Eastman and Rudy Giuliani both accused of plotting to claim Arizona's 2020 electoral votes for Donald Trump,
[00:04:02] pled not guilty in court. Julian Assange was granted permission to appeal against extradition to the US.
[00:04:10] President Biden signed a $105 billion EV-ation bill to increase air traffic control or staffing,
[00:04:17] enhanced runway safety and speed up refunds for canceled flights.
[00:04:22] Senate majority leader Chuck Schumer announced a renewed effort to pass a bipartisan border security bill.
[00:04:29] The US Supreme Court upheld the funding mechanism of the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau and Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell is working from home after testing positive for COVID-19.
[00:04:42] I am Grace G and this has been a moment of news.
[00:04:48] Thank you, Grace, for that moment of news is always appreciate you.
[00:05:00] Now it's time for my guest, Don Hicks to Farie.
[00:05:07] I'm sorry, Doctor, Don Hicks to Farie.
[00:05:12] Passing about the arts culture and education, Don is a scholar activist who has served as an elementary school teacher, a curriculum facilitator,
[00:05:21] an educational consultant, and currently serves as an associate professor of education and coordinator for the elementary education program at Winston Salem State University.
[00:05:34] Don is a hip-hop feminist who's researching interest include black feminist thought, black man elementary school teachers, hip-hop cultures influence on identity development,
[00:05:48] critical race theory and quansah as a site of resistance.
[00:05:54] The author of dozens of journal articles and book chapters, Don's highly acclaimed book the Journal of Kamal Miller, hip-hop composite canter stories of black men teachers was released in November of 2023.
[00:06:11] Ladies and gentlemen, it is my distinct honor and privilege to have as a guest on this podcast, Dr. Don Hicks to Farie.
[00:06:35] All right, Dr. Don Hicks to Farie. How are you doing? How are you doing today?
[00:06:41] I'm well, yes, how are you doing today?
[00:06:43] I'm doing lovely and I understand you got some special going on so we're going to try and make this too long for you.
[00:06:52] Let's you enjoy your day.
[00:06:56] But I'm really honored to have you on and I want to get into this thing about hip-hop feminism, but before we get into that, what I like to do with my guest is to offer a quote.
[00:07:11] So to kind of kick the interview off, so this is your quote.
[00:07:16] Because I am black and a woman, I have a particular way of knowing that is valuable and justified.
[00:07:26] And because of the intersection of my race and my gender, I have a particular epistemology standpoint that colors how interact with others and how I determine and see true.
[00:07:39] My truth, no longer needed validation. I was a diva sister in the making. What is that quote, me and you?
[00:07:48] All right.
[00:07:51] So a diva sister, so I guess I'll start there.
[00:07:58] A diva sister, the distinguished intellectual virtue with academic systems, the diva is a group of black women, women of color, in graduate programs when I was working on my doctorate and pretty much it was a support room.
[00:08:15] In a sense, and then it grew into a sisterhood where we supported each other as we navigated the doctoral program, right, doctoral program particularly at a PWI in the South, which can be a very hostile environment.
[00:08:31] So being a diva was about bringing all of the parts of me together who I am as a gendered being a woman who I am as a black woman, right, a race being and who I am being from the Bronx, right, my sensibility, the way I see the world, the type of music I listen to, right, which is the soundtrack to my life, hip hop.
[00:08:59] And all of those things coming together, someone who I have somewhat transcendent class, right, it's all of these things came together to kind of collide but also into mesh when I was working on my doctoral program and to find people who looked like me who had similar ways of knowing.
[00:09:23] And this space that was that I didn't even know as a child existed, right, I didn't even know that black women got doctorates like I thought when you call somebody a doctor, that were a medical doctor and that was there.
[00:09:36] I just I didn't even understand, I didn't have any kind of conceptualization of what having a PhD met or that was anywhere within my own breath.
[00:09:48] And so to be in this place, it brought really all of the parts of me together and that's what I'm talking about there with this intersectionality, right, my again my my woman nests my blackness, my my my cultural understanding, all of those things came together and it kind of really helps to situate me and help me see who I am and how I am and how I never get.
[00:10:18] And I think that was a large part of what being a devour man.
[00:10:24] So how did a girl from eating while projects get to the point that you're at now to be a PhD.
[00:10:31] To be a professor at when some say them stay.
[00:10:36] Wow, she dreamed and it's interesting because when people out of time think asked me, oh, did you dream of or what were your dreams?
[00:10:50] I say that I started by saying she dreamed, but at the same time, I didn't I really lived step by step like it was like okay what's the next thing I need to do.
[00:11:00] I need to graduate from high school okay and then when I was in high school I was smart I was just kind of naturally smart and I'm very.
[00:11:09] Inter personal I love people and extroverted so I was senior class president, I did all the things and in my counselor was like okay you're on a college that's where you want to go and I'm like I don't know where should I go.
[00:11:21] I don't know anything about college my parents think oh we're we're should I go and it was like well here's a list of places we think these are be good not some you know like literally that's kind of how we work out and then I went to college and started thinking about what is it I'm good at okay I like science I like.
[00:11:37] Biology, so I'm major in biology I'll be a biology teacher maybe for something and then biology didn't work out for me to well they've had the the work F to be a biology major.
[00:11:50] And so I changed my major to something that I started to honor myself right when I was in college like okay what do you really like I like people okay the like people so I made an insight college.
[00:12:01] Right and I'm mind it in anthropology and as I continue to explore and just be myself.
[00:12:06] I got graduated and and then got a job doing counseling work and teaching and and it really like I said it really is almost the snowball like I just found myself in situations with different people where they will like hey there's this opportunity here's this opportunity for you.
[00:12:23] And then when I married my ex husband he was a professor and they had I got my master's degree and they needed some people to add junk and teach classes and I was like.
[00:12:33] I could do that I think and so I started teaching developmental reading when I lived in Baltimore and it was an amazing experience and I loved it and then I started teaching teach teacher red classes for people who wanted to be teachers and I thought.
[00:12:50] I could really do this right I felt that I was good being a teacher I started teaching elementary school.
[00:12:57] I felt like I was a good teacher and I thought I could better serve children by teaching teachers and so as I continue to do that work.
[00:13:09] I found myself doing consulting work people were coming to me they wanted to hear from me they wanted to know what I was doing they wanted ideas they want to strategy then I feel like again looking at all those parts right those intersect those intersecting parts of me.
[00:13:25] I was doing work putting me in a place where I kind of knew stuff it was you know I don't know everything clearly but I knew what I knew right I know and I and then let me to say and hey you know maybe I did this doctor because.
[00:13:42] I thought you have to say and I found that people listen to that.
[00:13:45] You know we think about who will find was a black person people listen to that for us okay well let's go ahead and get this doctor you got to my business and you had.
[00:13:54] Let's go ahead and do it and do consulting work and continue to do the be a professor and teach teachers so to check in better served children especially better serving children.
[00:14:05] I did it and I just I just one step at a time I was not let me be very clear I was not a little girl living an even more projects you said one day I want to get a PhD and be a college professor.
[00:14:19] I really had no idea that that was a job like I remember watching the different world and I just thought the professors were just brilliant geniuses who.
[00:14:29] I didn't know I just didn't have a concept of what that was to be to teach in a college like I just didn't even know think that was attainable for me and it was just do a series of fortunate events.
[00:14:45] They really led me to space and it was being faithful.
[00:14:50] Being open and being willing to accept mentorship I think that's a very big.
[00:14:57] I've always listened to people I respect it and listen to people who I felt had my best interest at heart.
[00:15:08] And I think that's probably the main thing it's the mentorship that got me here yeah.
[00:15:17] So let me let me jump to that question then who's influenced do you draw upon the most in your work when you talk about influence was it is a bell hooks Patricia Collins or John Morgan.
[00:15:32] Oh goodness gracious that's a trifecta for me goodness gracious I'm going to say I'm going to go foundation right and I'm here about feminist I want to I'm going to go foundational and so.
[00:15:45] Bell hooks and so what I talk about mentorship and listening to people I have an interesting story I was about 18 maybe 19 and I was on the train with my friends and and I used to wrap I wanted to be a rapper when I was.
[00:16:01] Little school right I got a demo tape and everything I was pretty good we look at he was my name and and so I'm wondering train and you know I'm wondering I'm hanging on to the strap and the train and I'm wrapping my friends is that they're they're they're me on like good friends do you know they're helping me up.
[00:16:17] And and we're just joking and I'm just entertaining them and as a train is a stop as woman gets up and I noticed I had noticed I watch him but just New York so people watch you know.
[00:16:28] And she got up and she walked over to us and to me in particular and she said.
[00:16:34] Have you ever heard of Bell hooks and I said no and now I didn't notice one never seen any for my life.
[00:16:39] And she said I've heard of Bell hooks and I said no and she said well she has a book called Sisters of the game you should read it.
[00:16:46] And I said sisters of the year I said okay she got off the train.
[00:16:51] I don't know her name nothing else at the time she was like a old lady when the retrospect when I have a memory of her face is probably about 30.
[00:17:01] And so I went and got the book right I went to a film you know wanted a bookstore back then we had books to it and I went and I got the book and I read it.
[00:17:11] And when I told you that book she's my life it changed my life and and I don't know what she saw in me that made her tell me that in that moment.
[00:17:20] But the book helped to name help me to name things that I was thinking things that I had already thought about it was hearing in hip hop right patriarchy capitalism racism sexism all of these things.
[00:17:40] Bell hooks talked about in these books and she talked in that book in particular she talked about self empowerment and how and how to walk and being in what it means to be a black woman within this space.
[00:17:54] And I started to see the world there and I think without that book that experience bell hooks speaking to me through that text I've never been open for Patricia Hill Collins and I will definitely when I have been open.
[00:18:09] But Joe Morgan became another pillar for me much later in my life and so Bell hooks absolutely.
[00:18:19] And and also Bell hooks not just her content but it was also her style.
[00:18:27] All of writing that was very accessible to me like I could read it as an 18 year old girl I could read it and understand it and you can't say about most scholars right I didn't know I didn't know she was a scholar at the time and book read almost like a novel to me.
[00:18:42] And so as I grew in my own scholarship and started to end up all work I remember and I always said to myself I want to write like bill hook someone right in a way that.
[00:18:52] That quote unquote regular people can read and understand.
[00:18:57] And so she really like I said gave me a foundation as far as understanding and really to developing and cultivating an identity my own identity and as a writer as well and as a scholar helped to help to ground me as a scholar to let me know that you don't have to sit around and pontificate.
[00:19:21] You can talk to the people.
[00:19:23] You can just talk to the people because the people will understand you.
[00:19:28] Yeah.
[00:19:29] All right, so let's get into hip hop feminism describe what that is and how did the southern pepper record the show stopper reflect that.
[00:19:45] Woo.
[00:19:47] So.
[00:19:48] How feminism is a way it's an iteration of black feminism right so black feminism is a concern and an active resistance against how power impacts the racism gender to black right how black boys are.
[00:20:08] So did and stratified and and ostracized and schools how and vilified how black girls are vilified and and harassed and hyper sexualized and schools right that black feminism looks at hip hop feminism is this iteration is it it's an evolution.
[00:20:28] The third wave of black feminism where you have these women who were born these people not just women is making me hip hop feminist right make me feminist of all kinds.
[00:20:38] Of people who were born during the hip hop generation right so you have two turn tables and red lining in the 70s that's happening to really impact.
[00:20:49] How people see the world in black and brown you started to push back and resist and develop the culture that spoke to this design this this need to resist against the status quo to develop a way of being and seeing the world that spoke to.
[00:21:10] That that centered this resistance this I'm not going to do what you want me to do just because you want me to do right.
[00:21:21] So hip hop feminism starts there and then it brings in this this gender critique looking at not just resistance but what does gender and race in that in the intersection of those things have to do with it right how do we navigate society within a culture that has become.
[00:21:43] I prefer masculine and with this toxic form of masculinity how do we navigate a culture that.
[00:21:53] That speaks a language that we love but that often.
[00:21:57] Doesn't speak well to and of us as women right so it's this realm it's the situation is being situated within this realm of contradiction right I love hip hop and I also have to critique hip hop.
[00:22:12] I got to check hip hop and so it's a way of being that is kind of I think about the voice of the the consciousness right it's a way of being and being on car but at the same time feeling safe because you know you feel seeing.
[00:22:27] But I'm not going to let you get too comfortable because I want to make sure that you see me and not just who you think you see right so hip hop feminism my thinking is that it's a it's a radical and liberating feminist consciousness.
[00:22:42] It's a way again it's it's a way that not everybody wants to understand and that's okay because everybody doesn't have to understand everything so way that.
[00:22:53] Of seeing the world and of embracing and pushing back embracing things like one sexuality and one sensual nuances right and utilizing those things in ways that some people don't agree with.
[00:23:08] I'm just trying to say that it's a way of saying hey I'm a stripper and I'm okay and I love that about me because I know that I have this body and that I can use this body to get what I want.
[00:23:20] I can just me if you want but why you look crazy because you're using your body to get what you want and just because your body is standing in front of a classroom or standing on an an a.
[00:23:32] And a radio station right what makes how you use your body better than how I use my body because of the terms of the agreement that you write a patriarchy right so it's pushing back.
[00:23:43] Of all of those ideals and those those thoughts and beliefs about how we navigate spaces within our bodies and in what the culture not just the music the culture has to do with it right which which is again founded and based in.
[00:24:01] Resistance is pushing back and I think that's kind of what.
[00:24:07] Really helps to to move it is this evolution of resisting against this complex.
[00:24:15] Way of being.
[00:24:17] And so.
[00:24:19] When I think hip hop feminism.
[00:24:23] I was growing in me right as a child that I always say I am hip hop right I was more in 1974 the bronze and hip hop or 1973 and across we just intertwined it's not even when did you fall in love with hip hop kind of question because I didn't have a choice right hip hop to me I've just literally the sound back of my life is who I've always been always been.
[00:24:45] And so in 1985 I think.
[00:24:50] My sister David took me to the store and I had saved us and we'd be row my bike and record store and I bought the 12 inch of the show stopper is stupid fresh.
[00:25:01] I super nature right super nature was the first name song peppers first name and I heard non radio and it was awesome and the thing about it was there was the show right with Dougie fresh and slick Rick.
[00:25:15] And they had put out this record to show what they met this girl Sandy and they did turn all that stuff and then salt and pepper.
[00:25:22] Without this disc record right and I think it's super important especially now with the people to remember that.
[00:25:28] Yeah, but it was all about settling be right part of what the culture hip hop whatever come back by the day was he said hey we don't have to fight.
[00:25:38] We can settle these this beef they are we can settle our disagreements on a wax we can settle in one of the dance floor right so that's a large part of hip hop was often very much really beef is a of one of the founding principles almost of hip hop and so.
[00:25:57] Here are these women who hip hop had been male diamonds right still somewhere maybe not now so much but it's a very male dominated paper hardcore.
[00:26:07] System right cultural and here are these two girls in their teenage then they weren't much older than I was.
[00:26:17] And they said.
[00:26:19] Come on say let's stop the show and then show said but Douglas and Richard won't like it and she said so come on then let's stop the show.
[00:26:31] And that line right there when I tell you.
[00:26:34] Set me on my behind because what it was was here's the show a home song Doug impression sleep Rick we gonna stop the show okay so that's one thing but I need you to understand what it means we may say but Douglas and Richard won't like it.
[00:26:55] First of all they called them out their names right and hip hop my name is Nick Rick you just call me Richard you just call me by my government name that's what we call something right you they son didn't right Douglas and Richard won't like it and she said so.
[00:27:11] And I said oh snap that's what we're doing.
[00:27:15] They won't like it so like I don't care if they don't like it we're going to stop the show that little line for me was so I mean it was huge it was huge because it let me know that I could do I could affect change that I could stop things that I didn't want to happen that I could make.
[00:27:37] things go in a different direction that I could enforce and and and my voice.
[00:27:46] In front of others and if you didn't like it that sounds like a person who probably right but they won't like it so.
[00:27:54] He had to stop the show we're going to do this and that to me is is almost like a burning of hip hop feminism that line is just like we're to me with often is very found.
[00:28:07] That's why I'm going to call you.
[00:28:10] So I'm going to show you this this elevation of the Divine Family.
[00:28:25] I'm going to call you.
[00:28:28] And not in a dirty nasty way but in an empowering way because I'm going to call you with your mom and an angel.
[00:28:35] and I don't even care if you don't like it.
[00:28:40] And that to me was super empowering, super empowering.
[00:28:43] And so, to me, that's what the showstopper has to do with hip-hop and hip-hop.
[00:28:49] So, and that's interesting.
[00:28:53] You know, I remember Roxanne Chante,
[00:28:56] and when she went after, I guess it was UTFO,
[00:29:01] for whatever.
[00:29:04] That was kind of the record for a lot of us.
[00:29:08] That was like, oh, wow.
[00:29:10] Okay, we got the sisters in the game now.
[00:29:12] You don't upset him?
[00:29:14] So yeah, that was what you're doing to research.
[00:29:17] I was like, huh, that's an interesting take.
[00:29:20] It's interesting that that particular song was the one
[00:29:22] that got you, but you explained it really, really well.
[00:29:26] So in the spirit of that, right?
[00:29:29] How do you feel that hip-hop feminism is playing a role
[00:29:33] in American politics?
[00:29:36] Or is it playing a role?
[00:29:40] Oh, absolutely.
[00:29:41] Cardi B said, I didn't quite have to be sitting out with Joe Biden.
[00:29:44] So years ago, the role that hip-hop feminism is playing
[00:29:47] in American politics, I think that it's the empowerment, right?
[00:29:53] So again, at the root of hip-hop feminism,
[00:29:56] like I said, it's this radical and liberating
[00:29:59] from this consciousness.
[00:30:01] It's this pushing back.
[00:30:03] And so when we think about who women in particular are
[00:30:09] in society now, how they navigate the world,
[00:30:11] how they navigate the music world, how they navigating hip-hop
[00:30:15] is very, very present-pervalent.
[00:30:18] In 2020, I think it was Megan, Megan Estalian has a song
[00:30:23] and she says, this 2020, and we ain't going to talk about working.
[00:30:27] Like, we're not even talking about it.
[00:30:29] What are you talking?
[00:30:30] Like, I'm not even having a conversation.
[00:30:32] I'm not about to talk about working.
[00:30:34] Come on, right?
[00:30:36] And I think so when we think about that kind of thing,
[00:30:38] she has this wonderful conversation with Maxine Waters,
[00:30:41] best published where she did an op-ed
[00:30:44] and then Maxine Waters, I think probably reached out
[00:30:47] and then they have a piece that's published
[00:30:49] where the two of them are in conversation
[00:30:52] about being a woman and utilizing your voice.
[00:30:56] And so we have hip-hop artists in particular,
[00:31:00] hip-hop women in hip-hop who just move right within
[00:31:06] political spaces, even.
[00:31:08] Right on me, ladies, we're in our table
[00:31:10] but our ladies first in 1980, not?
[00:31:13] And if you watch the video, she's strategizing.
[00:31:16] Right? She's a general.
[00:31:18] They're not soldiers.
[00:31:19] They're not out on a battlefield.
[00:31:21] She's strategizing.
[00:31:23] War and how can we have a non-violence war?
[00:31:27] Right? How can peace be performed?
[00:31:29] We ought to watch that video with the critical lens.
[00:31:32] And so it's always been a part of hip-hop.
[00:31:36] Hip-hop has always been, excuse me,
[00:31:38] a hip-hop has always been a part of politics.
[00:31:40] Right?
[00:31:41] Fight the power, right?
[00:31:41] Public enemy talk about it.
[00:31:43] It's always been a part of politics.
[00:31:45] And so today I think we just see that even more
[00:31:48] and it's just a bit more of, it's almost much more natural
[00:31:54] than you want.
[00:31:55] I think it's not so much such a big deal.
[00:31:59] Like I said, some years of our remember
[00:32:01] there was this big conversation because Cardi B was sitting down
[00:32:04] with Joe Biden, you know, that asked questions
[00:32:08] and talk about her thoughts and ideas.
[00:32:11] We see lots of rappers have in conversations
[00:32:15] with politicians.
[00:32:17] I mean, you know, some of them not so happy to talk about
[00:32:24] but some of the really important spaces
[00:32:26] but I think it's just a demonstration
[00:32:29] of the fluidity of hip-hop and the power
[00:32:32] of hip-hop feminism in the fact that it empowers voices
[00:32:35] and it lends this liberating stance.
[00:32:38] I think if you ask me, now of course,
[00:32:41] I believe both need to self-fulke
[00:32:42] have to self-identify.
[00:32:44] So I can tell you somebody else is something
[00:32:46] that they're not saying that.
[00:32:47] But to me, Maxine Wood is looks in acts like a hip-hop feminist.
[00:32:52] You know, I mean, Jasmine Crocket, you know,
[00:32:55] just these women that are in these spaces
[00:32:59] and it's almost like there are in these,
[00:33:00] they're occupying these spaces just to tear them down.
[00:33:05] Right?
[00:33:06] It's like they're operating these spaces
[00:33:08] just to tear them down, Kimberly Jones gave this
[00:33:11] incredibly moving speech.
[00:33:13] And it was the same like it was just an interview.
[00:33:15] They stopped her, I'm thinking in 2020 during riots
[00:33:20] and things like that and they asked her, hey,
[00:33:22] wouldn't you think about black people rioting,
[00:33:24] tearing up their neighborhoods?
[00:33:25] And she said, you know, we can burn this stuff
[00:33:27] to the ground or like it because you broke the contract
[00:33:31] and you need to be grateful
[00:33:32] that what we're looking for is equality and not revenge.
[00:33:35] You know, I think that's hip-hop feminist.
[00:33:38] It's this idea that you need to be lucky,
[00:33:42] that you are lucky that what we're looking for
[00:33:45] is equality and not revenge.
[00:33:47] And when I think about that on this sort of black people
[00:33:50] but in particular with black women,
[00:33:53] when you look at what we have been through,
[00:33:55] what we have endured, people like to talk about the strong
[00:33:58] black woman and how strong we are
[00:33:59] and we strong and I try to be strong
[00:34:02] because we're strong because of the stuff
[00:34:04] we've had to endure and it was either die
[00:34:08] or live on so that our children did not have to be orphans.
[00:34:12] Like the choices that we've had to make
[00:34:15] and so that navigates in hip-hop as well.
[00:34:18] I love to see the plethora, the so many
[00:34:23] empowered women in hip-hop right now
[00:34:26] and I think that their presence is politically.
[00:34:31] Their presence is politically.
[00:34:33] It's the stance that the very in your face
[00:34:36] on a apologetic way that they're navigating
[00:34:41] the industry is politically.
[00:34:43] Yeah, and it's like when Megan,
[00:34:47] she had the tour of us along with Natasha Brown
[00:34:51] during the last election cycle
[00:34:54] going through the South trying to empower young black women.
[00:34:58] I spice, you know, it was like,
[00:35:05] somebody was like, why is I spice in the same box
[00:35:08] with Taylor Swift?
[00:35:08] I said if you know the history of I spice in the industry,
[00:35:12] her in Taylor Swift are like sisters
[00:35:15] because those two women have changed the industry
[00:35:18] as far as our artists get paid and how they can protect
[00:35:22] their work.
[00:35:23] So that's like that kind of thing
[00:35:25] but I kept thinking about when you went over that verse
[00:35:28] about Richard and Douglas and not gonna like it.
[00:35:34] So I kept thinking about like when Stacey A.
[00:35:39] Abram said, I'm gonna run for government.
[00:35:41] He's like, well, you know what?
[00:35:42] I'm focusing on like it and she like so
[00:35:45] when Angela also broke.
[00:35:48] Running for the US Senate in Maryland.
[00:35:51] It was like David Trone with all his total one money
[00:35:55] was like, hey, they're not gonna like that.
[00:35:58] Why are you running against David?
[00:35:59] He's got the money at it.
[00:36:01] So and you know, and both of them got to be nominees
[00:36:06] and I think Angela's gonna win
[00:36:09] and I don't know if Stacey's gonna run again
[00:36:11] but because she ran,
[00:36:14] it just opened up the floodgate.
[00:36:16] So I really liked that you brought that verse out
[00:36:20] because that verse to me really symbolizes
[00:36:26] what you've been teaching as far as it deals with hip-hop feminism
[00:36:31] but we're up against it so I wanna talk about this book
[00:36:37] and he wrote this book in our talker called
[00:36:40] the Journey of Camo Miller.
[00:36:42] And I'm gonna say it, Camo or Camo.
[00:36:45] Camo Miller.
[00:36:47] Hip hop composite stories for black male teachers.
[00:36:50] Talk about the book, what is objective,
[00:36:53] what is it's objective and how people can get a copy of it.
[00:37:00] So the Journey of Camo Miller is a love letter
[00:37:03] to black male teachers, right?
[00:37:05] So I think about being a teacher
[00:37:08] I taught in Brooklyn Brownsville, Brooklyn,
[00:37:10] I thought a teaching there
[00:37:12] and I saw how black boys were ostracized in school.
[00:37:17] So how they would push out,
[00:37:19] they would push them to special education,
[00:37:21] and they would push out of the building.
[00:37:23] And I started to ask questions, right?
[00:37:26] Well what's going on with the children?
[00:37:28] But why are black boys doing so poorly
[00:37:30] and then I looked around and I said wait a minute,
[00:37:32] where do black men teachers?
[00:37:34] And so I started again.
[00:37:35] So again, a series of questions
[00:37:37] and over time just really looking at
[00:37:40] why black men don't teach
[00:37:42] and they have very valid reasons, right?
[00:37:44] And so but what I wanna excuse me,
[00:37:46] what I wanted to do is talk to those black men
[00:37:50] who do teach.
[00:37:51] And I particularly wanted to talk
[00:37:53] to black men who were born during the hip hop generation,
[00:37:58] who will probably hip hop generation
[00:38:00] because I wanted to know why do you teach
[00:38:02] and what does hip hop have to do with it?
[00:38:04] Right?
[00:38:05] And so I interviewed these nine amazing black male
[00:38:10] elementary school teachers, right?
[00:38:12] Because even when we see black men in education
[00:38:14] we oftentimes see them in middle school
[00:38:16] in high school and their coaches, right?
[00:38:19] They're the PE teacher and they oftentimes
[00:38:21] have those opportunities.
[00:38:22] When we think of the upper grade secondary
[00:38:24] we think that you teach a subject, right?
[00:38:27] You teach math, you teach science.
[00:38:29] But when you teach elementary school
[00:38:30] you teach children because we teach all them, right?
[00:38:32] And the children at this very gentle learning year
[00:38:36] is we call them.
[00:38:37] And so I wanted to look at those men who despite
[00:38:41] the stigma, despite the stereo types,
[00:38:45] despite the low pay, why they taught elementary school.
[00:38:49] And again, I did hip hop influence any of this,
[00:38:54] any of their decision-making who they are
[00:38:56] and why they navigate the world.
[00:38:58] And so I interviewed these men, they weren't credible
[00:39:01] and what I wanted to do with this work
[00:39:04] was I wanted to go back to Bellhuts,
[00:39:07] present it to the world in a way that was accessible
[00:39:12] that was easy to read, that you don't have
[00:39:15] to sit with a dictionary and look up different things
[00:39:19] that's not interrupted by a bunch of parentheses
[00:39:21] with a long lines of references that you can sit on the beach
[00:39:26] and read that you can have a conversation with family members
[00:39:30] about.
[00:39:31] And so Derek Bell, who's a father of critical race theory,
[00:39:36] right?
[00:39:37] And a critical race theory as well, proudly.
[00:39:41] Derek Bell has this way of radical writing CRT,
[00:39:46] which embraces this unapologetic creativity.
[00:39:50] And that elapologetic creativity is taking the research.
[00:39:54] So taking actual interview transcripts, focus, group data,
[00:39:59] observations and leaving them together
[00:40:02] in a way that you design something called
[00:40:06] a fictionalized narrative or a composite counteness story.
[00:40:09] So what I did is I took those nine men.
[00:40:12] And I looked at the things that they said,
[00:40:15] the stories they share to me.
[00:40:17] And I weave them together to create Kamal Miller.
[00:40:21] And Kamal Miller is a third grade elementary school teacher
[00:40:25] from Harlem who lives out in Pittsburgh
[00:40:28] and he's teaching at Derek Bell Elementary School.
[00:40:31] And then what we do is we follow Kamal throughout a year
[00:40:34] in his life.
[00:40:35] That's why it's called the journey of Kamal Miller.
[00:40:37] One academic year.
[00:40:38] And we see Kamal interact with other people.
[00:40:41] He goes to the barber shop and gets a haircut
[00:40:44] and he gets into a conversation with the barber
[00:40:47] and another gentleman there.
[00:40:48] He goes on a date.
[00:40:49] He goes to the plant's acceleration
[00:40:51] and he's going to see how it elights
[00:40:53] and he has this great conversation with his one thing
[00:40:56] he's interacting with.
[00:40:58] He goes on up, he's going to a conference.
[00:41:00] He's an airport in Bumpton to a guy
[00:41:02] who belongs in the same organization
[00:41:03] and they have a great conversation.
[00:41:05] He's at a PTA meeting.
[00:41:06] We see him in different spaces and different situations.
[00:41:10] And in those situations, the dialogue that you read
[00:41:14] in the book comes from his nine men I interviewed.
[00:41:19] So the dialogue.
[00:41:20] So what is fictionalized is Kamal
[00:41:23] right being a composite character, meaning that he
[00:41:26] is the one fictional person who is embodies
[00:41:31] the characteristics of these nine men.
[00:41:34] And the situations that he's in,
[00:41:37] that's the context, is fiction.
[00:41:40] However, the content is not.
[00:41:45] So the conversation will come out, sits down
[00:41:47] in a barber shop and he starts talking to Jerry
[00:41:49] about in Jerry says hey, so what do you do?
[00:41:52] And Kamal says I'm a teacher, you a teacher
[00:41:54] and then they start having to kind of
[00:41:56] how do you get into that?
[00:41:57] Right, they have the industry's two black men
[00:41:59] having a conversation as opposed to you having to read
[00:42:03] my research from Dr. Tafari, right?
[00:42:06] Which is not as fun to read.
[00:42:08] But now it's a conversation much, much in the same tone
[00:42:13] as when I, when these men were telling me their stories.
[00:42:17] And so and again, they're in to week,
[00:42:19] but you won't necessarily,
[00:42:21] now these men, I'm sure, when they read the book,
[00:42:23] they can say oh that's me right there
[00:42:25] that's me, they can find themselves in there.
[00:42:27] But you don't know the way it looks to you
[00:42:30] is this is all come out, so, right?
[00:42:32] Some of the story will come from these characters
[00:42:35] that he, he, he interacts with.
[00:42:38] And so I'm really excited about the book
[00:42:41] because again it's this,
[00:42:44] we have to amplify the voices of black men teachers,
[00:42:47] you know less than 2% of teachers across the country
[00:42:50] are black men.
[00:42:52] And even less than that are teaching in our elementary school
[00:42:56] classrooms and black men love, they nurture,
[00:43:01] love children and there's nothing wrong with that.
[00:43:04] We like to villainize black male bodies,
[00:43:06] especially we villainize them just for existing
[00:43:09] in this country.
[00:43:10] But we also villainize them whenever they're in spaces
[00:43:14] with children like there's something wrong
[00:43:16] with black men love and children.
[00:43:17] And then we villainize them when they're not with children.
[00:43:21] They're gonna be dead.
[00:43:22] So black men are like you can't win in this country.
[00:43:25] And so what I wanted to do is really shine a light
[00:43:29] on those black men who love children
[00:43:31] and who love children purely
[00:43:33] and authentically and choose to teach.
[00:43:37] Choose to be elementary school teachers,
[00:43:40] choose to bring hip hop into the classroom
[00:43:44] and innovative and creative ways you'll learn
[00:43:46] you'll hear about that in the book as well.
[00:43:49] How they utilize hip hop in the classroom,
[00:43:51] how hip hop has impacted who they are.
[00:43:54] Each one of the chapters in the book
[00:43:56] has a song, a particular song that appears
[00:44:00] that kind of lays this foundation.
[00:44:02] There's a soundtrack to book.
[00:44:06] And so I was able, I was blessed
[00:44:08] to really interact with me.
[00:44:10] A cis name Dr. Iyosakai who is a black woman
[00:44:14] who owns a publishing company
[00:44:17] and academic person.
[00:44:18] I believe it's the only academic press owned by a black woman
[00:44:22] in the country, it's not the world
[00:44:24] and it's called Universal Right Publications.
[00:44:27] And so I met her at a talk that I was given
[00:44:31] and she said, listen, wish a book, you gotta book
[00:44:34] and you said okay.
[00:44:36] And so she worked with me
[00:44:38] and I created the book and I had been thinking about this, right?
[00:44:42] I had been thinking about the book
[00:44:44] and so I worked with her
[00:44:45] and her amazing publishing team to bring it out
[00:44:48] and it's so it's available
[00:44:49] on Universal Right Publications
[00:44:51] as you, WP books, UWP books.com.
[00:44:57] It's on Amazon, it's in a next chapter book store
[00:45:00] and give stop in Greensboro, North Carolina.
[00:45:03] And it's available online as well
[00:45:06] and so I have autograph copies of it for interested.
[00:45:09] I'm doing actually doing a book signing event.
[00:45:12] It's a celebration called Kick In It With Come Out,
[00:45:15] a celebration of black men teachers
[00:45:16] on Saturday June 1st at next chapter,
[00:45:20] give store, next chapter book store
[00:45:22] and give shop in Greensboro, North Carolina
[00:45:24] which is where I live.
[00:45:26] And I'm really excited about it again
[00:45:28] because I just feel like black men deserve this.
[00:45:31] And it's my gift, it's my gift to black men
[00:45:34] in the back of the book is a love letter
[00:45:36] to black men teachers.
[00:45:38] And I just feel like they just,
[00:45:39] we just, like I said, my heart bleeds for how
[00:45:46] brothers are seen and treated this world
[00:45:49] and then to choose a career like teaching
[00:45:53] which is already underpaid and overworked.
[00:45:57] And those men deserve our attention,
[00:46:03] they deserve our support and I deserve our love,
[00:46:08] even more importantly.
[00:46:09] And so that's what come out.
[00:46:11] The journey of come out, Miller,
[00:46:12] is this a love letter to black men teachers
[00:46:14] and I just, again, I wanted to write a book
[00:46:16] that my mom put in joy and that the teachers
[00:46:19] I interviewed could enjoy,
[00:46:20] that wasn't just written for other academics
[00:46:24] that that family could enjoy and talk about
[00:46:27] and learn something new about teachers
[00:46:32] and black men teachers in particular.
[00:46:35] Well, Dr. Sakai and UWP are friends of this program
[00:46:39] and part of the reason I was wanted to invite you
[00:46:47] was because you were part of that family.
[00:46:50] And I hope that everything works out with the book.
[00:46:58] If people want to get in touch with you real quick,
[00:47:00] how can they reach out to you directly?
[00:47:04] I'm on Instagram at Love Eats Bill, Love Eats Bill.
[00:47:08] On Instagram, Facebook, Dr. Goon Hick to Farrey.
[00:47:12] It's also Love Eats Bill, The On Facebook.
[00:47:14] So Love Eats Bill, On Facebook will take you
[00:47:16] to Dr. Goon Hick to Farrey.
[00:47:18] I'm also there.
[00:47:20] And I'm with the faculty at Winson Phillips University
[00:47:22] to number one HBCU in the nation.
[00:47:24] All right now.
[00:47:25] I want to say it's real.
[00:47:26] Oh, no, I know.
[00:47:29] You gotta say it.
[00:47:30] We're kind of person, would you give you
[00:47:33] if you didn't rep your age.
[00:47:34] Well, Steven A Smith will look good with you.
[00:47:36] That's what she wrote.
[00:47:37] Absolutely.
[00:47:39] Absolutely.
[00:47:40] There's a lot of people who will agree with you.
[00:47:42] But yeah, it's not going to the faculty there.
[00:47:44] So if you look me up, if you're looking at email,
[00:47:47] I have a conversation or I love to come and talk and lead
[00:47:51] a study group or book study or just to come
[00:47:55] and talk about the process of research.
[00:47:57] This one of the things I love to do
[00:47:58] is to work with both and particularly
[00:48:01] do our students and educators and help them know ways
[00:48:06] to share ways to bring their own thoughts
[00:48:11] to paper, right?
[00:48:13] To solidify, right?
[00:48:15] Because when we write books, that's this perpetuity.
[00:48:18] We're our thoughts of being saved in perpetuity
[00:48:20] and I think that's super important.
[00:48:22] So yeah, available.
[00:48:24] And that's some ways that people can access me, right?
[00:48:28] With the SILM faint university, you can look me up,
[00:48:30] go on to FRI, T-A-F-A-R-I.
[00:48:34] And to the ground, I love eat build.
[00:48:37] LinkedIn, Dr. Don Hicks to FRI, PhD.
[00:48:43] I think it's the LinkedIn sign, sign on call letters.
[00:48:50] And again, Facebook is Dr. Don Hicks to FRI.
[00:48:54] All right, we're Dr. Dr.
[00:48:56] Dr. Don Hicks to FRI.
[00:48:56] I'm all the social leaders.
[00:48:58] Well, I definitely understand that.
[00:49:00] I have to do it for the park.
[00:49:02] But Dr. Thank you.
[00:49:03] Thank you for coming on.
[00:49:05] I noticed it's been a busy day for you.
[00:49:08] Congratulations again on the personal achievement
[00:49:12] that you're celebrating today.
[00:49:14] And thank you so much.
[00:49:16] I appreciate you coming on.
[00:49:18] It's been an honor.
[00:49:20] Thank you.
[00:49:21] It has been an honor.
[00:49:22] I've appreciated the conversation.
[00:49:24] Thank you for it.
[00:49:25] Thank you for your interest.
[00:49:27] Yes, for him.
[00:49:27] All right, guys.
[00:49:28] And we're going to catch all of the other side.
[00:49:52] All right.
[00:49:52] And so we are back.
[00:49:55] And I want to thank Dr.
[00:49:59] Don Hicks to FRI for taking the time out to be on the podcast.
[00:50:04] The remote of book.
[00:50:07] I hope you all get the journal of Camille Miller.
[00:50:14] It is part of our relationship
[00:50:20] with universal right publications.
[00:50:26] And it's gracious founder, Dr. A. O. Succai.
[00:50:34] And we have developed this relationship
[00:50:42] to try to get as many of her writers on the podcast as possible.
[00:50:47] But we can't get everybody.
[00:50:49] And so I encourage all the go to their website, Google,
[00:50:53] Universal, right publications.
[00:50:54] Find out what they're about and go to their site
[00:50:59] and get some of the material that's available
[00:51:02] because it is a black academic publishing house.
[00:51:08] It's the only one owned by a black female for sure.
[00:51:12] And now I'm going to support
[00:51:18] the same black authors and black academics.
[00:51:21] But you'll get something of it as far as thoughts
[00:51:27] and opinions and research, right?
[00:51:32] So I'm grateful for that relationship
[00:51:34] and we're going to keep it going
[00:51:38] for as long as I have this podcast.
[00:51:43] So I wanted to do that but say that
[00:51:46] but I have some thoughts and several thoughts.
[00:51:56] And it's all kind of a theme.
[00:52:00] I'm going to close it out with it.
[00:52:01] But right now we have two of the most
[00:52:09] unethical Supreme Court justices sitting
[00:52:13] on the highest court in the land.
[00:52:17] It's Clarence Thomas and Samuel Lito.
[00:52:24] And neither one of them was appointed by Donald Trump
[00:52:32] so you can't blame that on him.
[00:52:34] It seems like the people that Trump appointed,
[00:52:36] I mean we even had one guest come on and vouch for
[00:52:39] one of their appointments.
[00:52:44] It seems as though they seem to be rather reasonable
[00:52:48] even if they are conservative.
[00:52:53] But well, suffered a job decision
[00:52:57] but that's a whole middle conversation.
[00:52:59] We kind of saw that coming.
[00:53:06] And this recent case with South Carolina
[00:53:11] allowing those racially-jerium and
[00:53:14] or districts to proceed forward
[00:53:17] which protects Nancy Mace
[00:53:22] from having to run against or to be seriously challenged
[00:53:30] by a descendant of Robert Smalls who was
[00:53:35] the first black congressman of South Carolina.
[00:53:43] So there's that.
[00:53:48] But we kind of know Clarence Thomas
[00:53:51] in a situation, those of us in the black community,
[00:53:55] we dealt with him forever.
[00:53:56] I personally had to deal with him in a case I was involved with.
[00:54:04] But, you know, Lito was considered
[00:54:12] a reasonable guy.
[00:54:15] And then something has switched.
[00:54:18] Maybe it was because Obama called him out
[00:54:23] at a state union dress.
[00:54:24] Lito didn't call him out.
[00:54:25] He actually called the whole Supreme Court
[00:54:26] but Lito hasn't been to a state union since that moment.
[00:54:36] But, you know, when you start using Vexology
[00:54:45] to express your political opinions to your neighbors
[00:54:51] and, you know, plus all the trips and stuff
[00:54:55] that he's been getting along with Clarence Thomas.
[00:54:59] It's pretty apparent that he doesn't have the ethics
[00:55:07] to sit on that court.
[00:55:10] And especially, he's gonna be biased
[00:55:14] on any decision dealing with insurrections
[00:55:17] or presence of immunity.
[00:55:23] Let alone anything that will help,
[00:55:26] protective rights of black people.
[00:55:33] So when people say elections don't matter
[00:55:39] just remember that president's appoint
[00:55:41] Supreme Court justices and senators either
[00:55:47] well, senators advising consent
[00:55:50] and they either reject or confirm
[00:55:52] those presidential nominees.
[00:55:57] And all those people get elected.
[00:56:01] So if you don't think it matters,
[00:56:03] then just watch what happens.
[00:56:11] Watch what is happening
[00:56:13] and watch what will happen in the future
[00:56:15] if you maintain that attitude.
[00:56:18] Nonetheless,
[00:56:24] you know, the appeal to heaven flag
[00:56:27] that's flying at Alito's vacation home
[00:56:32] is one thing.
[00:56:36] And people probably saw that
[00:56:37] and was like, oh well, you know, whatever.
[00:56:40] Get a pine tree phrase on it, whatever.
[00:56:46] Not too many people probably saw any harm.
[00:56:48] Right away, but then when you fly
[00:56:52] the upside down flag, American flag at your crib
[00:56:57] that your main resident,
[00:57:02] that's a strong local message for those of you
[00:57:05] don't understand.
[00:57:09] And upside down flag is only supposed to be flown
[00:57:14] when you are in trouble.
[00:57:18] In the military, if you see
[00:57:22] a battalion or a ship or some, you know,
[00:57:26] a base you come across and that flag is upside down.
[00:57:29] That's a warning.
[00:57:32] At something bad is happening to them.
[00:57:37] And it's either time to get reinforcements
[00:57:39] or to hurry up and get to that spot
[00:57:41] to be the reinforcements, right?
[00:57:46] And so people have adopted that as a sign of protest
[00:57:52] when you fly the upside down flag,
[00:57:54] you are sending a message that you're not pleased
[00:57:56] with the United States government
[00:57:58] or you're not pleased with.
[00:58:00] Policy is the United States government
[00:58:02] or you're not pleased with America as a concept.
[00:58:10] And it's been used by people throughout history,
[00:58:18] I guess, or throughout this age of civil disobedience
[00:58:22] to send a message.
[00:58:26] Now, the appeal to heaven flag and
[00:58:29] the upside down American flag
[00:58:32] were in prominent display on January six
[00:58:36] on the steps of the capital during the insurrection.
[00:58:38] Many of the people that participated in that
[00:58:43] use that symbolism.
[00:58:47] So for somebody on the Supreme Court
[00:58:50] who is going to make decisions
[00:58:52] about whether those January six insurrectionists
[00:58:55] will get out of jail or the president
[00:58:59] that sent them will be given immunity.
[00:59:04] You would think that that person would re-cus themselves.
[00:59:11] But we know that human beings are who they are
[00:59:15] and human beings that have no ethics
[00:59:19] or no respect don't care.
[00:59:27] About that.
[00:59:29] We had a situation in Mississippi when people sued
[00:59:37] to clear myself
[00:59:42] to change the state flag.
[00:59:47] The judge that it was assigned to had written a book
[00:59:50] on the history of the Confederate flag
[00:59:56] and it was not a critique.
[00:59:59] It was a glowing historical reading.
[01:00:04] And when the attorneys asked that judge,
[01:00:06] recuse himself, not only did he not recuse himself
[01:00:08] but he tried to sanction those attorneys
[01:00:12] then once the attorneys fought the sanctions
[01:00:15] then the case could go forward
[01:00:20] which eventually led to the state Supreme Court saying
[01:00:22] that none of us had standing
[01:00:26] because technically there wasn't a state flag.
[01:00:28] That was a snafford that happened
[01:00:33] in the change of the state code.
[01:00:35] And whatever code that was in,
[01:00:42] the Mississippi code, whatever code section
[01:00:44] was in the Mississippi code prior to the 1904.
[01:00:50] Excuse me, let's take it out inadvertently.
[01:00:54] So there was no code for a state flag
[01:00:56] unless there wasn't a official state flag
[01:00:58] and eventually it led to Mississippi changing their flag
[01:01:06] 100 some odd years later.
[01:01:09] Anyway, so we know that judges do what they wanted to
[01:01:19] when they want to do it.
[01:01:22] So I'm not surprised that a leader is not recusing himself
[01:01:34] but I am pissed that he's not.
[01:01:38] Right, I'm upset because it's pretty obvious
[01:01:42] if you're flying the flags that were used in the insurrection
[01:01:48] that means that you support the insurrection.
[01:01:51] You blame on your wife, you can blame it on whoever you want
[01:01:54] blame it on but as your house is your house is
[01:01:59] to make any statements.
[01:02:03] And people have seen it.
[01:02:04] People have taken pictures of it.
[01:02:07] It is what it is.
[01:02:12] And if you're not mad enough to step aside
[01:02:17] knowing that that's your view, then that's unethical
[01:02:25] and all he's doing right now,
[01:02:33] all he's praying for is that he am anklant.
[01:02:36] All they're praying for is trump to be reelected
[01:02:39] so they can resign and then trump could basically
[01:02:45] leave and it's amazing to worse present in history
[01:02:49] and United States could actually have five people
[01:02:52] appointed to the Supreme Court if you get selected
[01:02:55] to a second term.
[01:03:01] That's an incredible legacy for somebody
[01:03:03] of Donald Trump's caliber but nonetheless,
[01:03:10] that's where we are with a leader.
[01:03:15] Now there's another black man I want to single out
[01:03:21] and it's Byron Donald's.
[01:03:25] And I try to as a black man as somebody
[01:03:30] has been elected to a position who's taking it
[01:03:35] and off to defend the Constitution.
[01:03:38] I try to give people latitude even if I disagree
[01:03:42] with them on policy but it is embarrassingly shameful
[01:03:50] to see the level that this brother is going.
[01:04:00] That was one thing and maybe he had a moment
[01:04:04] where, you know, and I highlighted it
[01:04:06] that it was a historical moment
[01:04:09] that he was nominated to be Speaker of the House
[01:04:15] during all that Kevin McCarthy mess
[01:04:20] and it would have been his story if he had gotten to be Speaker
[01:04:25] but I think something clicked on that ego side
[01:04:34] on the dark side of that ego side
[01:04:38] and he is decided that he will say and do anything
[01:04:44] to be in the good races of those folks
[01:04:49] that we call MAGA supporters.
[01:04:55] So the latest atrocity that he has done
[01:04:59] because he is presumably on a short list
[01:05:05] to be Vice President,
[01:05:11] the Vice Presidential nominee for the Republican Party
[01:05:14] under Trump.
[01:05:17] I don't think that's gonna happen but it might
[01:05:22] the media is treating him as he's a potential nominee
[01:05:25] so we'll go with that.
[01:05:31] But he got on social media and he's been on TV,
[01:05:37] especially on Fox News and said that President Biden
[01:05:43] tried to assassinate Donald Trump.
[01:05:50] What all that stems from is whenever DFBI
[01:05:58] has to do a search, just the server warrant,
[01:06:00] there's language in there that basically
[01:06:03] authorized the discourages them from doing it
[01:06:07] but it gives them authorization that as a last resort,
[01:06:12] you can use deadly force.
[01:06:14] Just basically legal stuff and they have now turned
[01:06:23] that comment language into a talking point to say,
[01:06:28] oh look, Biden tried to kill Trump.
[01:06:33] Now, it's a terrible plan if you send somebody
[01:06:38] to a man's house and you know the van is not there.
[01:06:42] That's not a good assassination attempt,
[01:06:45] just for the record.
[01:06:48] But nonetheless that's what they're doing
[01:06:49] in our Donald's one of those guys.
[01:06:52] Now, by our Donald's was a financial planner
[01:06:58] by profession before you got elected to Congress.
[01:07:01] He was a guy who was advising people
[01:07:03] how to set up their retirement accounts,
[01:07:06] how to manage their assets.
[01:07:11] And was making a good living doing it.
[01:07:16] And if you just run into him in the street,
[01:07:20] seems to be an affable person,
[01:07:25] good family, all that kind of stuff.
[01:07:32] But you know when you start spouting off crazy stuff,
[01:07:38] that kind of changes the perception.
[01:07:43] And you play the game where it's like when somebody asks you
[01:07:49] directly, do you feel as though that was an accurate statement?
[01:07:56] Then you start spouting off everything
[01:07:58] about what Joe Biden ain't this
[01:08:00] and Hillary Clinton ain't that in blah, blah
[01:08:02] and it's like, look man, I ain't got time for all that.
[01:08:07] Do you think that was accurate that you said
[01:08:11] that a president of the state to try to kill your friend?
[01:08:17] Now, we were talking about Hughie Newton
[01:08:19] and we were talking about Malcolm X
[01:08:20] and we talking about my king
[01:08:22] and we talking about maker ever.
[01:08:23] So somebody like that.
[01:08:26] And Jack Hoover was already FBI.
[01:08:27] Yeah.
[01:08:30] I could believe that.
[01:08:32] Because there's documentation to prove it.
[01:08:38] But to say that a president of the United States
[01:08:47] somebody like until Biden.
[01:08:49] Now, Donald Trump, possibly.
[01:08:55] Because I might like a Joe Biden.
[01:08:58] Who's gone through the political process?
[01:09:01] To say that they're trying to take you out.
[01:09:06] That's an ego trip and that's all that is.
[01:09:09] It's like I'm so important that they got it killed me.
[01:09:14] You're not that important, Mr. Trump.
[01:09:16] You're not.
[01:09:17] You're just another guy who got to be president
[01:09:21] who wants to job again.
[01:09:22] That's it.
[01:09:24] No more no less.
[01:09:27] Now, what we're afraid of is that if you get in there,
[01:09:31] you're going to think that you got that position for life
[01:09:34] and you're going to put people around you
[01:09:37] to try to make that happen.
[01:09:40] And God help us
[01:09:43] if the majority of Americans fall for them.
[01:09:48] But to be a synchaphat for that narcissism
[01:09:53] is a major problem, especially when I see it coming from a black man.
[01:09:58] Who's elected?
[01:10:02] Because an average citizen who's black can say what they want to say.
[01:10:08] If you want to go to the Bronx and
[01:10:11] from the 25,000 people and say Donald Trump's the greatest things
[01:10:15] in sliced bread and yada yada yada and all this stuff's alive,
[01:10:18] that's on you.
[01:10:21] And you can go vote for them.
[01:10:23] But when you take an oath to defend the Constitution,
[01:10:28] when you sit in a position where you're making decisions
[01:10:32] over three trillion dollars at the minimum
[01:10:37] and you're making policies that will govern the country.
[01:10:46] You might need to get the facts right.
[01:10:51] You might need to deal with credibility.
[01:10:58] You might need to embrace it.
[01:11:04] But ambition is a powerful drug
[01:11:09] and if he feels that he's got to tell these lies
[01:11:12] and all this stuff to get where he wants to be in life
[01:11:16] then that's on him.
[01:11:20] But just like you have to write a lie,
[01:11:22] I have to write the call bullshit on your lies.
[01:11:27] That's out of first amendment works.
[01:11:30] And as somebody who has taken that of several times
[01:11:38] in different professions, including being an elected official,
[01:11:42] I really call bullshit on that.
[01:11:44] And I think you can do better.
[01:11:47] We ain't got a degree on policy,
[01:11:52] but we have to agree on facts.
[01:11:56] How you take those facts.
[01:12:00] To address your policy argument is one thing,
[01:12:05] but you have to agree on the fact.
[01:12:08] If you think Joe Biden ain't it,
[01:12:10] if you think Hillary Clinton ain't it, that's fine.
[01:12:15] There's some people on my side or the aisle that think that way.
[01:12:22] But you don't get to lie on them.
[01:12:26] You don't get to lie on them.
[01:12:29] Just like you don't want people lying on your guy,
[01:12:32] don't lie on ours.
[01:12:33] Just as simple, you don't want to support the president.
[01:12:40] Cool, but don't lie on them.
[01:12:48] Not for your political gain
[01:12:50] to get the pat on the back from the whiteboard.
[01:12:54] It's at the top of the ticket.
[01:12:58] Don't do that.
[01:12:59] There's no need for you to do it.
[01:13:01] You can be a black Republican and still be a man of eye.
[01:13:05] You can still be a black Republican
[01:13:07] and have integrity.
[01:13:09] That is possible.
[01:13:10] I have seen it in my life.
[01:13:13] I know people who are black and Republican
[01:13:16] and have integrity,
[01:13:17] we don't agree on stuff
[01:13:20] and it makes for fun conversations.
[01:13:24] Whether it's at a bar or in a place of government,
[01:13:32] but I'll never question their integrity
[01:13:36] until they start doing stuff like you're doing.
[01:13:38] Defending the end of offensive, lying for no reason.
[01:13:44] That's a problem.
[01:13:50] And then I've,
[01:13:54] but it's all a theme, right?
[01:13:58] Because he's, of course, not the only one,
[01:14:00] but of course my favorite,
[01:14:02] Marjorie Taylor Green, M.T.G.
[01:14:05] as she likes to refer herself,
[01:14:07] I'm a refer to as 6B from now on.
[01:14:10] So when you hear me say 6B talking about the Congressal win
[01:14:15] from Georgia,
[01:14:19] and the reason why I'm gonna call 6B
[01:14:21] because that's what Jasmine Crocket
[01:14:23] to represent it from Texas.
[01:14:27] Kind of referred to her as technically.
[01:14:32] We knew we was just talking about,
[01:14:33] but the way she said it under the rules
[01:14:37] of parliament procedure,
[01:14:41] she didn't directly say it.
[01:14:45] Under the last, we knew who represent a Crocket
[01:14:48] was referring to when she said what she said.
[01:14:54] And if you've been under a rock for the last couple of weeks,
[01:14:59] go look up 6B or Jasmine Crocket
[01:15:05] and you know what I'm talking about.
[01:15:09] Now let me say this.
[01:15:10] I'm not encouraging people in public office
[01:15:14] to go there,
[01:15:16] but when you go there first
[01:15:19] and it seems that though that the people in leadership
[01:15:22] will allow you to go there,
[01:15:24] then just expect a clapback.
[01:15:28] Just expect to get drove, just expect,
[01:15:34] to get a response that you're not gonna like.
[01:15:38] She had to nerd to say, oh well,
[01:15:40] I'm gonna tell them about 6B, she said,
[01:15:42] oh yeah, you all feel in her?
[01:15:45] Well, as obviously her feelings were hurt
[01:15:46] because she put up some kind of video showing her working out.
[01:15:50] We saw you work out in 60 minutes.
[01:15:52] We know you got a gym.
[01:15:53] We know you owned it.
[01:15:56] But you are who you are.
[01:16:00] You know but again, when you devolve into the plurable behavior,
[01:16:06] you're gonna mess with the wrong one
[01:16:12] and do I want my people in Congress to act that way?
[01:16:17] Of course not, but you get what you give.
[01:16:22] If you are disrespectful,
[01:16:24] you're gonna be disrespectful.
[01:16:27] Period.
[01:16:30] And if you don't conduct yourself in a certain way
[01:16:35] on a positive end,
[01:16:37] then you're gonna get what you deserve.
[01:16:41] You're gonna mess with the wrong one.
[01:16:46] She's already tried to fight other members,
[01:16:49] whether Democrats or Republicans physically fight them.
[01:16:57] And so the rule that she violated
[01:17:02] is because one member beat another member with a stick.
[01:17:09] Somebody from the South beats somebody from the North with a stick.
[01:17:13] Sister, it is what it is.
[01:17:22] So you know, if you wanna go back to those days
[01:17:24] where members walk up to each other
[01:17:26] and start beating together with kings
[01:17:28] and walking sticks and all that stuff,
[01:17:29] then that's on y'all, but that's not what we want.
[01:17:36] That's not what the citizens want or deserve.
[01:17:39] We want people to understand a magnitude
[01:17:41] and position that they're in and act accordingly.
[01:17:46] And we also want y'all to have some courage.
[01:17:49] Right, and this is my final point.
[01:18:01] When you run for public office,
[01:18:03] you are going to engage in verbal warfare
[01:18:07] which you're opponent in one way,
[01:18:09] shape or the other.
[01:18:13] You don't want it to get personal, but you do engage in it.
[01:18:20] And anything that you did in the past, whether it's policy
[01:18:23] related or personally, possibly come up.
[01:18:33] But when you get to the point
[01:18:36] in this day and age where you say that somebody
[01:18:45] is unfit for the office that you're running for.
[01:18:51] And then turn around and say,
[01:18:53] I'm a vote form and given the stakes
[01:19:01] of the particular election,
[01:19:04] then that's a lack of courage.
[01:19:09] I don't know how many times we have had to make a decision
[01:19:12] in the black community where we had to vote
[01:19:17] against our traditional interests
[01:19:19] because of the person who was running.
[01:19:28] If we realize, I'm a taste.
[01:19:31] So just break it down, see, understand.
[01:19:33] If Barack Obama was not qualified
[01:19:35] to be president, black folks would have voted for.
[01:19:41] Yes, there was an incentive for black people
[01:19:44] to vote for a black man to be president of the states.
[01:19:47] But if he was hurt, you'll walker.
[01:19:49] He wouldn't have won.
[01:19:54] That's about as plain and simple as I can make it.
[01:19:58] He wouldn't have won.
[01:20:02] And if you're a Republican
[01:20:05] and you don't think Donald Trump should be president of the states,
[01:20:07] then be man and woman enough to stand on it.
[01:20:12] There are Republicans out here who have said that.
[01:20:15] There's a whole group called the Lincoln Project.
[01:20:20] Built their whole organization on that purpose.
[01:20:29] But Nikki Haley has never been a woman of courage.
[01:20:36] And as appealing as she might be to folks,
[01:20:43] she would never be appealing to me,
[01:20:45] Democrat Republican, whatever because the wind's blowing
[01:20:49] from the east, that's what she don't come from.
[01:20:51] If it's blowing from the west,
[01:20:53] she's gonna change direction.
[01:20:56] That's just how she rolls.
[01:20:59] How she got as far as she got.
[01:21:04] It is what it is.
[01:21:05] But the reality is that
[01:21:09] from this day forward,
[01:21:11] we gotta stop giving these people a platform.
[01:21:15] We gotta have men and women in both parties of conviction.
[01:21:25] She gave this long speech about
[01:21:31] and she was addressing the fact
[01:21:32] whether she was gonna drop out or I think she was dropping out.
[01:21:37] And she basically made the case
[01:21:38] why Donald Trump should not be president.
[01:21:42] Period.
[01:21:45] And then somebody tried to come back and say,
[01:21:47] well, she says she's on vote from the seat in an endorsement.
[01:21:50] Do a vote is an endorsement.
[01:21:54] If you say you're gonna vote for the guy, that's an endorsement.
[01:22:00] You trust that man.
[01:22:02] You laid out if the Democrats can run your speech
[01:22:07] and at the end say,
[01:22:11] vote for Joe Biden and Joe Biden can say I proved his message.
[01:22:14] That's how bad you trust Donald Trump.
[01:22:17] And then you get in front of a bunch of conservatives
[01:22:21] and say, well, I'm a vote for him anyway.
[01:22:26] Because Biden has been a catastrophe.
[01:22:27] First of all, that's a lie.
[01:22:30] A catastrophe is having a president
[01:22:33] and offers during a pandemic in millions of Americans dying.
[01:22:39] We're getting sick even.
[01:22:41] That's the catastrophe.
[01:22:48] And the guy did use that, you know,
[01:22:49] of O4 was the president during that time.
[01:22:55] But Joe Biden has done something worse than that.
[01:23:03] That didn't happen.
[01:23:06] So, you know,
[01:23:09] I'm really disgusted with the devolution
[01:23:18] of the Republican Party.
[01:23:22] If I had dinner Republican on my life
[01:23:25] and saw this going,
[01:23:26] I would be even more devastated.
[01:23:29] I would have to be a Democrat
[01:23:35] or I would have to be an independent.
[01:23:38] I couldn't, my conscience
[01:23:42] as they black man in America couldn't embrace that.
[01:23:51] But being a Democrat
[01:23:54] and being somebody that, you know,
[01:23:59] you make mistakes, you're accountable for them.
[01:24:03] When you have to go before a mic,
[01:24:05] you have to have all your facts straight
[01:24:08] when you go up on a day as you have to have your facts straight
[01:24:11] to the beta bill.
[01:24:17] You have to stand before your constituents
[01:24:19] and explain what's going on.
[01:24:24] The one thing that you need to have
[01:24:29] is integrity.
[01:24:33] You need to have courage in your conviction.
[01:24:38] And you need to be honest
[01:24:43] and you need to elevate your people,
[01:24:51] your constituents to appreciate them.
[01:24:57] If you cater to the lowest calm denominator,
[01:25:00] you're going to get garbage each and every time.
[01:25:05] You as a leader have to elevate the discussion.
[01:25:12] But if you don't have to moral capacity to do it,
[01:25:18] it's going to be a disaster.
[01:25:19] Not just for you but for the people
[01:25:22] that you're supposed to serve.
[01:25:25] And I really hope, really, really soon,
[01:25:34] that those folks under Republican side of the aisle
[01:25:39] elevate themselves so they can elevate their constituents.
[01:25:47] This is not a TV show.
[01:25:49] This is not a game.
[01:25:52] The decisions that you make,
[01:25:55] whether it's at the Capitol or whether it's at the statehouse
[01:25:58] or whether it's at City Hall,
[01:26:01] could have life or death implications for the people
[01:26:05] that you serve.
[01:26:10] I'll always tell people when they get elected do no harm.
[01:26:14] I don't understand why that's a hard concept
[01:26:17] to understand under Republican side.
[01:26:19] I really, really don't.
[01:26:22] And I really, really pray.
[01:26:25] They get to act together.
[01:26:30] I wish that the Democrats could have a clean suite
[01:26:36] that they win every race that they run.
[01:26:41] This election cycle just to send that message.
[01:26:45] It's not going to happen.
[01:26:49] But I'm hoping that enough people support
[01:26:53] Democratic candidates in their respective areas
[01:26:58] to send the message.
[01:27:03] Diggy Haley's got people still voting for her
[01:27:06] and she's stopped running too almost three months ago
[01:27:11] because they don't support the other guy
[01:27:17] and then you're gonna insult all of them by saying,
[01:27:19] well I'm a vote for this guy anyway.
[01:27:22] What are we doing?
[01:27:26] What are we doing?
[01:27:30] So you know, that's just the way I think about things.
[01:27:37] Let me know what you all think.
[01:27:40] Keep listening to the podcast,
[01:27:44] keep supporting me on Patreon.
[01:27:48] And I'm gonna get some new content up on a Patreon real soon.
[01:27:56] But I've had this opportunity
[01:27:59] to say what I wanted to say on the regular podcast.
[01:28:03] But we're gonna do that.
[01:28:05] We're gonna get the blog going again too
[01:28:07] because it's just so direly important for people to have
[01:28:14] a voice that is calling bullshit and all those stuff.
[01:28:23] But I do it not, I don't hate
[01:28:28] but out of a belief
[01:28:31] that we all can do better.
[01:28:35] If I didn't believe that,
[01:28:37] I wouldn't be doing this until next time.