Philly Division of Reentry Executive Director Assata Thomas talks life, advocacy, and new book

Puts up. The artist is done in fresh and you're watching, and we talk weekly. You're listeners. Right here every right. Were always about solutions and making sure we get the information as accurate as possible. And so how many boy Charles Gregory. It's beautiful Lawrence and the beautiful and we have someone with whom might have a tremendous amount of respect for. We want to talk a little bit about some of the things that they have going on. So I ain't gonna give it up because we gotta. We want to talk a little bit about her bio. So ready for me? Yes, So we have the beautiful miss Ascide of Thomas. She is the executive director of Philadelphia's Division of re Entry and a nationally recognized voice and criminal justice reform. With more than twenty years of experience and the lived experience of overcoming a felony conviction, she brings both expertise and authenticity to her work. She's led major transformation in Philadelphia's re entry system, expanding services, building a coalition of over one hundred and fifty organizations, and opening the city's first community based re entry center. A Rutgers graduate with a Masters and Restorative Justice and recent leadership training from Harvard Kennedy School. She's also an award winning advocate, author of Forward, Only Speak, Power, Live Change, and a proud member of Delta Sigma Thetis. Let's give a huge, huge we talk weekly. Welcome to the beautiful miss aside of time. For that. I I love that. How are you my sister? Let me get your mic right, I don't hear you? Okay, Thank y'all so much. Thank you for coming. It's absolutely pleasure to have you. Make sure I've changed. This like this, like. Yeah, so, how are you feeling today? Especially like you know all that you're doing. How do you even feel the have the time to you know, just to well, we're excited to even have you because you're doing so much. And kudos to you for all the work that you're doing. How do you feel today? Thank you for asking that. I feel well today. I'm a recent empty nester and so I'm trying to no, it's good. No, no, So I know I can't reclaim that time, but I'm certainly squeezing the juice out of everything that's happening. So I feel well today? Can I feel rested? I had an event earlier today and so I rested. I feel good today. Thank you for asking awesome. That's awesome. Yeah, well, we're so glad to have. You here, and and and just thank you for the work that you're doing and the giving back that you do to the community, especially for this time now, you know, a time now when it's so much support is needed and people are just looking for hope and change. You know. That's awesome. That's awesome. Yeah, you have. You have such a background. I don't even know where to. I'm usually like, all right, let's start from the beginning, but the beginning is is even big, right, So so all right, all right, let's let's all right, let's start with the school. All right, let me start with the school. So shout out to doubt the sigmaating you know, I remember my brother I got to shout out my brothers, you know, So I have to talk about you know, I'm traumatized. See if you came up through my time, you're traumatized. So you understand what you understand what I'm saying. And so but no, it's it's a pleasure to have you. And so let's start with the schooling, right. And so you came into school and you realized that you were. You were meant to fight for the people, right, you were meant to advocate for people. What was the impetus that? What was it that made you feel like, you know what, I'm empowered, I'm encouraging. This is the direction that I'm going to go. Did it happen in school? Did it happen even before you. Went to school? Yeah, so it's opposite that I went to school much later in life. Okay, so for me, it happened as a result of my of a felony conviction that I got, and that was the impetus when you are trying to find a job, when you're trying to find housing, all of these things that happened to persons who are impacted. That is the direction that led me to the work that I'm doing now. I would absolutely say that it found me. I wasn't looking for it, but as a result of all the things that I had gone through, the schooling came and then the next schooling came, but it found the advocacy I think has always been a part of me growing up, you know, always speaking to systems and powers and people that I didn't even know what that meant at the time, and so it's always been in me, but this specific direction came as a result of my own story. Fantastic, So we'll get into you. We'll get into your story, but let's talk about like your parents then you know what what how how did they, you know, start the voyage or the journey or or the support for the things that you do. That's interesting. My mom is here with. Mom around la clause outside of the mom should see that the smiling I love moms man, I love. My first best friend. And so I am of a Jamaican heritage. Both of my parents are Jamaican, and so I am we are first born. My brother and sister are not here. And so how we grew up many many many years ago. It wasn't cute to be from a Caribbean family, and so our culture, the things that we did were very much different. Experienced racism altogether, but also xenophobia, you know from with right that whole face exactly. And so growing up for me, although I had a wonderful childhood, there was the difficulties in the code twithing that happens when you leave your home and go out and you talk talk differently. All the things that you get right, and so my parents were, particularly my mom was just this still is this infrastructure of strength from which I stand from where I still continue to stand. She is and always will be the wind beneath my wings. And so that's my beginnings. Yeah, my gosh, that's the song that I sing to my mom. Yeah, that song absolutely Yeah, sorry. Yeah, no doubt that was. She had a little moment there. And so let's let's jump into some of the awards, because I want to get to your story, because it's a dynamic story, but I want to I want to walk through that because I want to know some of the initial things before we get into like your personal your personal stories, you know. And so you have gotten uh, you have gotten awards, you know, and. You're just like you're just a trail I mean, she got the trail. I was about to say, you a trailblazer. You've got a trail Bludze award, you know, Uplifting Solutions. Let's talk about that. November twenty twenty four, recognized for the Trail Brades Awards from Uplift Solutions. Let's talk a little bit about that and what was how did they recognize you for that? Yeah, so coming into this position that I am am in. Now, there are things that are happening within division that has never happened in the history of this division, and so it's gone through several iterations of names. But when I came in, of course, if you're, to my opinion, a smart leader, you take time to learn the culture, see what's happening, what has worked, what hasn't worked. You just bring your own kind of seasonings to it. And so that Trailblazer Award was based on me taking a different direction with the office and really moving forward in an intentional way. And that's how that Trailblazer Award came about. Restorative justice. I think that's probably a concentration that's so undervalue. Right, How do we as a community that's in dire need of that specifically, right, how do we as a community recognize this to make sure that our communities are more amplified in their voices right to be supported and to get resources and to get support in that particular field of restorative justice. Yeah, that's so good restorative justice. If you think about how. The system is created, Yes, it's victim and defender. Don't talk to them, don't look at them, You're not supposed to have any type of conversation or. Direct I love it. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, there we go. Yep, thank you. Yeah. The system, the system is built and created for us not to have conversation with these each other. And so when you when. You think about how that is that continues on even into our communities, and so specifically for restorative justice as we're talking about it, for a crime that has happened, that you have the victim and you have the offender, and those are not words that I use, but for purposes of this conversation, it's embedded that you don't speak to each other, and so restorative justice as a practice brings those two parties together. Yes, And so it's forgiveness of what has happened. It's understanding, and it's not necessarily now we're best friends, but it gives an understanding for both sides of how you impacted my life when you took my child, my son, my father, my daughter, whatever it is. And the person has the opportunity to apologize, and so it doesn't take away what happened, and they're not necessarily released or those other things, but there's an opportunity for dialogue because our system is not set up for those persons to have a dialogue. Yeah, yes, yeah, And that's very interesting because sometimes even if you think of that and the mental health, you know, capacity, that may bring about some type of for that person. Yes, whereas like they're able to mentally you know, have like not necessarily closure, but it does like help, like you know, whereas like they don't have an interaction with that person, they're not able to express themselves or like there's no release. So yeah, I do like that. Yes, Ms Thomas. How do you know when the maybe the victim or victim family is ready to hear what maybe harsh to them? And how do you know when the offender is ready to actually give us sincere apologies to bring them to the table. That's a great question. And so everybody is not ready for restorative justice right in times it takes years of talking to both sides and to prepare them to be able to have this dialogue. And so it's. Years of talking to the to the victim and years of talking to the offender and then bringing them together for a conversation. So it's not just hey, we want y'all to talk, and it's really years and like you said, the mental health part of that that's involved, and how it doesn't necessarily bring closure, but hearing what happened that. Night, Yeah, tell me why did you do it? What happened? And so it takes years of having these conversations, and not everybody wants to do it. If I'm being real right, it's for the folk who really want to have that conversation. And it's not good or bad. It's just yes, I want to or yeah, no, I'm good. I'm just gonna stay where. A yeah, yeah, yeah. So you also became the first female president of the Corrections Officers Training Academy in New Jersey. So I don't know where to start with this. Yeah, and I was just like, wow, that's amazing because if you think about the training part itself, that going through that in and of itself, that's rigorous because you're going through these nineteen weeks or so of training, which some people don't even pass that. And then after that, you're going through you know your job, and you're you're you're learning all these things, and then you become this president, the first female president, which means you've so you've surpassed so many other individuals. Can you talk about that experience and what did that feel like? Sure, that was It feels like a lifetime ago. But that was many, many years ago. And when I when I look back over my life, I understand that everything was for purpose and for where I am now to be able to do this work with such credibility. I worked in this I was a coo yes, and so becoming the president of my corrections class, thinking about it, I'm the most lea least athletic person you will ever meet. In this world. But I remember even then you asked me earlier about a question for advocating, And I remember even then when we were in the training academy and there were some things that were not being spoken of for women, and I'm saying, well, wait a minute, we have to be able to do X, Y Z. And it wasn't exercise. There were some things that were just being overlooked and specifically geared toward men. And so thinking about advocacy, I'm thinking about it even in that realm, and so being elected the president of the class was certainly an honor, and I didn't think about it again at that time. It was wonderful. It was an honor. I was young, I had three babies. I'm just say, how do I get out of this and go to the next thing? But again, thinking about my entire life and how that plays into where I am now, was certainly something that was necessary. Yeah, you were being prepared and molded for what was yet to come. Absolutely correct. Yes, that was That was awesome, Thank you. Yeah, so I want to jump into your story over twenty years and personal. Battled a personal situation which involved the felon. How did you navigate that and what was that experience in you know, before and then afterwards? You know, great question, and so as I was navigating it, it was the most shameful, embarrassing time of my life. And again it happened when I was older. I wasn't a kid. I knew better, and it was a very shameful time of my life. What hit me impacted me the most was that not the impact that it had on me so much, but my family and so the reverberating effect of how that showed up my names and newspapers in three different states, those things that they had to deal with, and I was content to take in my own licks as it were, but the impact for my family still want to think about it is. It causes emotion because I brought that shame so to speak to the family, and so how I navigated it was. Wasn't a media It took me years to. You know, going through therapy, doing my own healing work and saying, you know what this thing happened. I cannot change that it happened, but I can change how I move from this. And it sounds really glossy and pretty now years later, but it wasn't then. It was dirty. So for those who don't notice the juin you want to share. So for those who, yeah. Sure I accepted a benefit that I wasn't entitled to, is the nexus of what happened and so received a felony conviction as a result of it. I will say for clarity though I was not incarcerated, and so people tend to put that on the story. And now that it matters one way or another, is that I do I did. I do have a felony conviction, and in impacts the way that I live. Getting a job, you know, those those things initially was very very impactful and even now in fact today I was looking at something that had to fill out an application. What do they ask? So it doesn't matter that I've risen to this level of executive director, had these positions and speak and have a book and all those things. It comes down to one of the questions, where do you have a felony conviction? And I still can feel the anks that rises in me when I have to check yes. Yeah, you know the. Glossy side, right, is the story that you're able to tell for those who are coming after that and has to has the challenges of navigating that space. Right. You are such an advocate about re entry, you know, and one of the things that we constantly talk about, especially on the show, is given information to those who may miss that information, right. And one of the things that we have constantly spoke on the show, and I'll tell you the story just to kind of give context. We did a story about a returning citizens and there was a major election coming up. Gentleman approached me on the street and was like yo, yo, yo, yo yo, broken English, you know, but yo, you you that guy? And I'm like, what are you? What you talking about? You know? He was like, yo, if it wasn't for you, pretty much he was saying, if it wasn't for you, and him watching the show he wouldn't know that he was. Able to vote yes yes, which was. Very It was a pivotal moment for us because sometimes we never know who's watching the show and who we're helping, right, And so to hear that, I said, we're doing the work, so we want to keep doing the work. And so to pull it back to you and your. Story, I think the work that you're doing is so necessary and important that I don't even think you know the like that you are the people. So I just want you to embrace that and accept that because we get that. I'm an advocate of like you know, are our return to citizens because they have no clue and they're already labeled, for the most part, right, sometimes labeled in a way where they can't even get any type of resources or experience or jobs when it wasn't even them that got them in the first place. And so we have to do more or have more conversation on what this looks like, how do we negotiate the space and get people truly re entered and engaged in. Life right in. The community again so they can be better for the community, right, Because if you block them out now, you're putting them in a position where now they have no other choice, right, And so with that as a context and all the information, how do you approach the conversation of the importance of this work? That was great context and a good question. The importance of this work is realizing that people who have been impacted, first of all, just one of the most brilliant if you sit and have conversations this entrepreneurial thread that runs rampant through persons who have been impacted by the criminal legal system. And I want to know, I. Say legal instead of justice, because there is no justice in the system. And so when we talk about the importance of how necessary it is, you said that or you alluded to that. If they're not giving opportunity, then you're going to revert back to doing what you did to get you in trouble the first place. And so thinking about employers and how important it is for employers to hire persons who have been impacted. Thinking about the work that we're doing in my office, are created a curriculum for workforce development called Gateway to Success. And there are a lot of workforce development programs, but this specifically is embedded with cognitive behavioral therapy and intervention. So that it's not just you got to get to work on time, right, it's dealing with the trauma. Because getting a job is low hanging fruit. We can get anybody a job that's low hanging fruit. It's how do you get a job that's sustainable A and B where you will stay because you are dealing with this trauma, you understand that there are ways and mechanisms in which you can move through your day to stay at the job. And so I'm really excited about that what we're doing at the office, but also just really amplifying the work and thinking about for example, when the September twenty twelve for the for the persons who are convicted as juvenile life first came home, a lot of them came home right over four hundred. When you think about feeling now the amount of work that they are doing is massive. You have Selim Holbrook, who is the ed Yes Sali Kempus songs are like, these are my comrades who we do work with and when you think about they were scheduled to die in prison, and so just using some of those as examples about the brilliance that exists and able to use our lived experience to further, like, listen, we are making change. We can make change given an opportunity. I don't use the word or the phrase second chance because I believe that a person deserves whatever chance they need. And I also believe that second chance is rooted in the theory that person's. Got an equitable first chance. M hm. And that's often not the case for those who have that's happening. I mean that that's a dissertation. That's a dissertation in mind when yeah, so interesting, shout out, shout out to shout out to Jill, shout out to you. Uh, when interesting. So so with that, with that, with that as. An understanding, right, we know that there's a lot of movement right now that's happening politically, you know today, How do anyone navigate that system now when they're they're removing a lot of the rights that we once had, right and to to your point, because I would love you to answer that, though, but it just reminds me of when we say laws and what's illegal. There was a time where we couldn't drink in a water fountain. Certain water fountains, we get, no, you can't do that, right, And so when I hear certain frameworks and policies that are in play what's happening now that they're easily being pulled back and real back. So how do one that's just re entered and navigated space like that that they can't even touch? So I want to lean in on something that you said lynching was legal too, right, So when you think about the laws and how they were not built for persons of black and brown. But that's like you said, that's a we can go another day. You gotta come back for you heard. Them coming back. I got to come back for that one. But one of the ways in which persons can learn about what's happening come down to our office. That's one place. And there are over one hundred and fifty orcs in Philly that do re entry work that my office has personally vetted. Right, So I'm not just sending you on this wild goose chase so that you can understand your rights and what. You are able to get. And to your point again about voting, we just did a voter listening session with Commissioner Severe and really understanding that because people think they don't have the right to vote, and just giving information and giving that information from a place that A is non judgmental and B is really elementary starting from the big civics because often we're people are so consumed and concerned with voting for the highest office and not understanding that these local elections this is the most important time. Which is very challenging and frustrating for me because all of those people that was out there advocating, oh, you should vote for this person, I don't hear anything about now and this is the most important time. No one is singing anything. Is weird to me that there's a lot of there's such quietness or lack of marketing or promotion for this particular time when we are faced with the idea of redistricting and things of that nature, which is nuts to me. But I digress. This moment is for you, right. And so I want to know based off of all of this, Right, let's talk a little bit about what your organization does. So people who are watching that they need certain services, help, you know, introductions, resources, what do your organization one? Where is it located? Because you mentioned like let them know where it's located, But let's talk a little bit about what your organization does. Absolutely, so the overall goal is that we're focusing on recidivism through coordinated efforts with these one hundred and fifty orgs at my office overseas as the Philadelphia Reentry Coalition, and through this we are impacting those who have been impacted by the criminal legal system. So the main office is fourteen twenty five Arch Street. We have two co locations of the neighborhood resource centers that y'all spoke to earlier. One is on Venango and one is on the Lewest. One is on. Broad and Lehigh at the ODABT where Old Dad is and so persons can go there to get support. Now, some of the things that we offer our expungements, we do those almost monthly. We have a workforce development as I spoke to, We have training cdl Phlebonomy sprinter Box, all at no cost to the participant. We are absorbing that cost case management. We don't do housing directly, but we do align people with housing because that's one of the major barriers to coming home because you can't. Oftentimes the first concern is you got to get a job. You got to Yeah, you got to get a job, but you have to live someplace as well, And so that's some of the work and we also partner with other organizations for what we don't directly do. We have services that we have partners that we refer out to. And when I say refer out, I want to be very clear. It's not oh, go down the road and make it right and turn that you're gonna talk to somebody. That is not what we do. It is a direct referral system. Either somebody is walking you to the next place or we're on the phone when they. Get their call us. Because people get lost from one location to the other, you know when you go, so we feel like you'll be a spun y'all say come here, I gotta go over here, I gotta go here. Yeah, no, we're not doing that. We offer identification. There are a myriad of things. If you go on our website deal Or you will be able to get. All the information of what we do. D You can email d Or at Philla dot gov and the email address. Go on the phili dot gov web website and it will take you to Division of re Entry. And what are the requirements were like being eligible for any of. The No requirements, just come on down. No requirements, love that, no green tape, no. Tape. Just go get that work, to get that work done. I want to I want you expand a little bit more about the you know, when when people are trying to get their record exponged, right, can you elaborate a little bit more on what their process is in what it actually does and who has the ability to do that because there's some you know, miscommunication based off of that also. Yeah, yeah, So expungement is to clear your record. So that is it is as if the offense never happened. And so that process is and I don't don't quote, I. Don't know it. I'm not the lawyer. I don't know what crystal clear, but you have you not tried to get my expongs by the way, they said I couldn't. But that's another We had to come back about three more times to get all. You people must be idiots. What are you doing? Are you people out of your mind? Are you just. Doesn't qualify? But it's okay, we talk about that. Yeah, I'll get you. Okay. So yeah, so you speak to to We have attorneys that are there, you know, on site. They if you qualify your crime qualifies for you have to be have not committed a crime within a certain amount of time can't be active on parole or probation, and then they take the process and go further and is. It limited to crimes in Philadelphia or Pennsylvania. For the yes, you would have to go to each state to get your record expis Yes. Wow, my sister, I appreciate you coming on the show. Such a such a trailblazer, right, I. Have one work question. Yes, what would you say of I mean all of your cases and the people that you helped, what would you say was one of your greatest success stories that just made you feel like everything that you went through this was worth it. I can think of two off the top of my head. There was not at this job, but the one prior I had, but doing the same type of work. There was this gentleman who was incarcerated for forty seven years and I we had been in contact with him before he came home, and so he was like family to us, you know, myself and the staff, and I remember when he when he came and he was like a deer in headlights. He said, the last time he was in the city, he doesn't even recognize it anymore. The public transportation and so one of the things I remember about it is well, we had balloons, we had all the things, and I've learned not to do that again because it was too much. But I was just so excited. So he came in and we were able to support him with health care immediately because that's what he needed. He didn't know what medications he was on. He was incarcerator for forty seven years, and so they'd just given him meds he didn't know. And so to have the ability to connect him directly to physical care and now to watch him he checks in every once every month or so to just say hey, miss Ti, I'm doing good, and that he's navigating after I keep saying forty seven years, because you kind of even fathom. Forty seven years of being locked up. And so that is one of that one is close near and dear to my heart because we were very hands on with him before he came home, and so having him come home and helping him to navigate the infrastructure of re entries really a successful story for me. Wow. We talked week to Talk on wpp M LP Philadelphia one o six point five FM. We talked weeklys after to Talk with your Boy Charles Greg and. Beautiful Lauren and the beautiful. Tenisa Henry, my sister, my sister. Before I let you go, right, what's the legacy that you want to leave. That's a wonderful question. I'm going to answer that by saying, I'm carrying on the legacy from my grandmother Ian Burke and my mother Joyce Russell, and I'm carrying on that legacy of advocacy. I'm carrying on carrying on the legacy of being a voice to not the voices, because I believe everybody has a voice, but their ability to amplify and the voice be heard. I want to carry on that legacy for my children and my grandchildren so that they have the boldness and tenacity to speak up even when it's not popular, and to use their voice in freeing others so that we are free. Indeed, yes, that was powerful. It was. It was spoken like a prayer from you, as they say, from your lips to God's sears. Yes, yes, shout out the mom, shout out the mom. You can you can tell that each generation has done its job. Yes, yes, So how can I get in kind of you got the right name, my sister, job right there, beautiful, I'm real curious mom during that time. Was that a big name? I mean, you know, because we had some trailblazers. Power right there. So I changed my name. That was my birth name. I changed my name. Is my sur is my sheer Rod forever? I mean, yeah, there you go walking. Spaces, I say, I am my name. Are you already ye? Yes, yes, we talked after the talk. So why don't you let everyone know how to get in contact with you again. We're locate you all that little stuff there. Yes, so you can contact us UH for the Department of Department of re Entry for the city Philadelphia on philadekov. We are on Instagram at Division of re Entry, on Facebook and on LinkedIn to contact me personally, I am at SATA Michelle dot net and the telephone number for re Entry is two one five six eight three three three seven zero. Fantastic. I'm glad we were able. To give you this platform for you to, you know, to amplify your voice because I think you have You're needed in the streets right then. You definitely needed in the streets right now, and we can get more people to reach out. I think we will be doing a. Service today, absolutely absolutely, So I just want to thank you. I truly want to thank you for coming to the show. I love my, I love my, I love my citizens that's not here right now that will be returning. You know, most of my friends had brushes with certain systems, you know, and have been done unfairly, unjustly, you know. And so you know, when I see people that's actually fighting for the good fight, you know that it means a lot, you know what. And before we let her go, for that person who is watching and that person that has had that felony conviction, who made that mistake, and who is looking at you and watching you, and say, I want to do what she is doing for that person that's going to come behind me and make a mistake, because in life we make mistakes. It's it's life. No one is perfect here, no one walking this earth is perfect. What can I do? I'm almost but they're. They're looking at you, and they're saying, what can I do to walk in her footsteps? Give that person advice? Yes, First, I will say that shame is bondage and forward is freedom. And I would say that as you begin to align internally, then your external change. And so the beginning is understanding that identity precedes narrative. And so as you begin to learn who you are and recover your identity, you begin to walk out and walk forward only. And as you close out, tell us a little bit about the book. Forward only speak power Life, Change, Yeah, change, Yeah, Yes, this book. When my first book, everybody expected it to be my autobiography, and I understood just as I said, that identity precedes narrative, and so it was important for me to write this book, which is a book of declarations, and it supports persons in finding out who they are and really speaking life because I believe in the power of the tongue and death and life is in the power of the tongue. And so when you declare who you are, come on you declaring. When you're declaring positive positivity, you begin to change. That internal alignment begins to happen. And so this book is really about declaring your way out of wherever you are a. Lot of gym. You have some quotables, you have to hand some quotables one more time. How can I get in contact with you? Sure Asata Michelle dot net or at a Department Division of re Entry, City of Philadelphia, d O R and. The book is on your website. Yes, yes, great, great, great great. Shout out to you. Shout out to mom mom did. Ye oh yeah, happy mother, Happy Mother's Day. You both. They are fantastic. All so, I don't want you guys to go anywhere when we come back. We got another story we got Oh it was it was just all right, well, why don't you go and do it before we cut off? Give it to us. Let's get a little story. Got a couple of seconds. Get listen. It was I had to find it now. Oh, so it was. It was just a little mini story. So Dave Chappelle he sat down with Michelle Baum and her brother for There in My Own Opinion podcast, and they were talking about this cancel culture when it comes to comedians and how they're not really able to make jokes like they used to make jokes, Like they can't you know, you know, do what they used to do because now it's cancel culture. So Dave Chappelle is, well, Michelle Obama is basically saying, like, well, the younger generation is different from the older generation, whereas like the younger generation they could just kind of jump on social media and they can make their jokes in their their audience is not in the room, whereas like the older generation back in the day, you had the Martin lawrences where they you know, the audience was there and they said what they said and at the end of the day that was pretty much it. Well, the younger generation, they're more negative and they're doing all the stuff for clicks and likes. So pretty much like what do you think, like, should should it be canceled? Culture? Should should they be able to say what they want to say? Or like. Should they be police? Like is the younger generation pretty much getting away with less, you know, because they're not in somebody's face and they can say something more negative because back in the day when you were you are social, like somebody gotta hunt you down. Pretty much with Chelle was saying, you know. Well it makes sense what with the generation he's from, so he would say something like that. But yeah, like my generation, like you disrespectful, you pay for being disrespectful, right, So I mean it's not to be said. I'm always in a conflict because I'm an attorney, right, So I'm like, but I understand exactly. What you said. You can't you can't just go and like just like you know, you see people just running up and putting cameras in your face and stuff like that, and yeah, yeah, oh it's a prank. So somebody don't know what that they not for these pranks. We ain't doing that, like we ain't want to type time, So do that to your friends friend. Friend. Yeah that was that. Was it, all right, y'all. So that's our show, you know. So it's super excited. This was a dynamic show, fantastic interview. As you all know that when you come to the show, we're trying to give you the information, right, we're solutions based here, so we don't want to point fingers. We want to try to find what these solutions are. How can we fix these streets, How can we fix the community? How can we fix what else? And broke has been broken in the community, right, and. So that's what we're here for. So I don't want you to go anywhere, and make sure you tune in next week. I'm your boy, Charles Grey with the beautiful. Laurence and a beautiful Tenisa Henry and a beautiful. And one thing that we always sing on the show. Once you come to the show, your friendship show, so you always want all right, so then you have it. Ladies and gentlemen were out here like last year. Hey, if we cannot let me complete unless. You listen to or watch me talk quickly, please believe me. Bar