What does it take to build a lasting acting career in an industry that keeps changing?
On this episode of The Demia Avery Show – The Industry, Demia sits down with Jason Lockhart, President, co-owner and Head of TV & Film at Atlanta Models & Talent (AMT).
With more than 25 years in entertainment, Jason has experienced the industry from nearly every angle—from child actor to award-winning writer/director to talent agent. He’s also the bestselling author of Ask an Agent and host of Talent Agent Talk.
Jason talks about what catches an agent’s attention, what actors may be worrying about too much, how the actor-agent relationship is changing, opportunities in the growing world of vertical productions, and what actors need to understand about building a career today.
And, of course, we put Jason on the spot with a round of “Yes, No, It Depends!” 😂
🎬 Subscribe to The Demia Avery Show – The Industry for more conversations with the agents, casting directors, managers, coaches and entertainment professionals shaping the business.
#JasonLockhart #TheDemiaAveryShow #TheIndustry #TalentAgent #AtlantaModelsAndTalent #AMT #ActingCareer #Actors #ActingIndustry #FilmAndTV #AtlantaActors #TalentAgency #AskAnAgent #TalentAgentTalk #VerticalSeries
00:00:00 --> 00:00:01 If you've
00:00:01 --> 00:00:03 got dream, come closer.
00:00:03 --> 00:00:04 >> [music]
00:00:04 --> 00:00:07 >> If you want to shine, come over. We're
00:00:07 --> 00:00:11 breaking all the rules tonight.
00:00:11 --> 00:00:12 Every step [music]
00:00:12 --> 00:00:16 in the spotlight is the extreme
00:00:16 --> 00:00:17 where
00:00:17 --> 00:00:17 >> [music]
00:00:17 --> 00:00:21 >> where everybody trying to fit.
00:00:21 --> 00:00:25 Oh, lights [music] flash, cameras see.
00:00:25 --> 00:00:27 Oh, living out the movie dream.
00:00:27 --> 00:00:29 Oh, [music] baby, yeah.
00:00:29 --> 00:00:30 Dream.
00:00:30 --> 00:00:32 >> Hello everyone. This is Demia Avery with
00:00:32 --> 00:00:35 the Demia Avery Show, The Industry. And
00:00:35 --> 00:00:37 you guys, I have such a special treat
00:00:37 --> 00:00:39 for you. He's been in the industry for
00:00:39 --> 00:00:42 more than 25 years as an actor,
00:00:42 --> 00:00:44 award-winning writer, and director. He's
00:00:44 --> 00:00:47 a best-selling author, and now he's
00:00:47 --> 00:00:49 guiding many actors in their careers.
00:00:49 --> 00:00:51 He's the president, co-owner, and head
00:00:51 --> 00:00:53 of TV and film at Atlanta Models and
00:00:53 --> 00:00:56 Talent, host of Talent Agent Talk, and
00:00:56 --> 00:00:58 he's never been afraid to tell actors
00:00:58 --> 00:01:00 what they really need to hear about the
00:01:00 --> 00:01:02 business. Today, we're talking about how
00:01:02 --> 00:01:04 the industry is changing, where the
00:01:04 --> 00:01:06 opportunities are, and what actors need
00:01:06 --> 00:01:09 to know right now. Please welcome the
00:01:09 --> 00:01:13 amazing Jason Lockhart. Welcome.
00:01:13 --> 00:01:16 >> Well, thank you. Thank you for having me
00:01:16 --> 00:01:17 on your show.
00:01:17 --> 00:01:18 >> [laughter]
00:01:18 --> 00:01:20 >> You're so welcome. You're so welcome.
00:01:20 --> 00:01:23 So, okay, we're going to start out here.
00:01:23 --> 00:01:25 Now, you literally grown up in the
00:01:25 --> 00:01:27 industry. You started as a child actor
00:01:27 --> 00:01:29 and have since been, like I said, a
00:01:29 --> 00:01:32 writer, director, filmmaker, and an
00:01:32 --> 00:01:35 agent. When you look back, what do you
00:01:35 --> 00:01:36 understand about the business now that
00:01:36 --> 00:01:37 you
00:01:37 --> 00:01:40 you know, that you understood when you
00:01:40 --> 00:01:42 were auditioning?
00:01:42 --> 00:01:44 >> I mean, the biggest thing I see is how
00:01:44 --> 00:01:47 many moving parts this industry has.
00:01:47 --> 00:01:50 And it's really easy as an actor to
00:01:50 --> 00:01:52 forget that you're just one of the parts
00:01:52 --> 00:01:54 because it's all about your audition and
00:01:54 --> 00:01:56 your face and your close-up and your
00:01:56 --> 00:02:00 lines and your moment, you know, your X
00:02:00 --> 00:02:01 to hit.
00:02:01 --> 00:02:01 >> Yeah.
00:02:01 --> 00:02:03 >> And um
00:02:03 --> 00:02:06 after all these years, I really realized
00:02:06 --> 00:02:08 that when you can completely forget all
00:02:08 --> 00:02:09 of that
00:02:09 --> 00:02:11 and that you're just one of the many
00:02:12 --> 00:02:13 parts of the machine,
00:02:13 --> 00:02:14 >> Right.
00:02:14 --> 00:02:16 >> there's this huge pressure and stress
00:02:16 --> 00:02:18 that kind of disappears. And at the same
00:02:18 --> 00:02:20 time, you realize I'm just here to help
00:02:20 --> 00:02:22 make sure everything's working.
00:02:23 --> 00:02:23 >> Right.
00:02:23 --> 00:02:24 >> And then you're serving and you're
00:02:24 --> 00:02:27 giving. It's just a a mind-blowing
00:02:27 --> 00:02:29 difference in the success I see with the
00:02:29 --> 00:02:31 actors that understand that psyche. And
00:02:31 --> 00:02:33 I've definitely learned it and seen it.
00:02:33 --> 00:02:36 >> Yeah. Now, you've been in LA and now um
00:02:36 --> 00:02:39 in Atlanta and you watched the Southeast
00:02:39 --> 00:02:41 become this major production hub. What
00:02:41 --> 00:02:44 are you seeing happen in Atlanta right
00:02:44 --> 00:02:45 now that excites you about where the
00:02:45 --> 00:02:48 industry is going?
00:02:48 --> 00:02:50 >> You know, after the pandemic, Atlanta
00:02:50 --> 00:02:51 was one of the first to really bounce
00:02:51 --> 00:02:53 back, if you remember, it kind of in the
00:02:53 --> 00:02:55 fall of 2020.
00:02:55 --> 00:02:55 >> Mhm.
00:02:55 --> 00:02:57 >> And then I feel like we kind of went
00:02:57 --> 00:02:59 through a slow season again with an
00:02:59 --> 00:03:01 abrupt stop with the SAG-AFTRA strike in
00:03:01 --> 00:03:04 2023, and it's taken a lot longer for
00:03:04 --> 00:03:06 the industry to bounce back from that
00:03:06 --> 00:03:10 until like the full budget um numbers
00:03:10 --> 00:03:12 that we were seeing in in in production
00:03:12 --> 00:03:14 and square footage being rented here in
00:03:14 --> 00:03:16 the city and then the Southeast in
00:03:16 --> 00:03:16 general.
00:03:16 --> 00:03:17 >> Mhm.
00:03:17 --> 00:03:18 >> Um
00:03:18 --> 00:03:20 but it's slowly coming back and I'm
00:03:20 --> 00:03:22 really excited right now in this fall of
00:03:22 --> 00:03:24 2026.
00:03:24 --> 00:03:26 Um we went from four or five projects a
00:03:26 --> 00:03:28 few months ago to
00:03:29 --> 00:03:30 to double digits. You know, there's
00:03:30 --> 00:03:32 there's a new movie, a new full-budget
00:03:32 --> 00:03:33 movie
00:03:33 --> 00:03:35 every few days on the breakdown and
00:03:35 --> 00:03:37 another brand new show with numerous
00:03:37 --> 00:03:39 episodes ready to order to series.
00:03:40 --> 00:03:40 >> Mhm.
00:03:40 --> 00:03:43 >> And um I'm seeing really talented actors
00:03:43 --> 00:03:46 book things because they were ready.
00:03:46 --> 00:03:46 >> Yeah.
00:03:46 --> 00:03:48 >> You know, these actors during the slow
00:03:48 --> 00:03:49 times, they weren't sitting around
00:03:49 --> 00:03:52 complaining that it was slow.
00:03:52 --> 00:03:53 You know, they were updating their
00:03:53 --> 00:03:54 materials.
00:03:54 --> 00:03:54 >> Yeah.
00:03:54 --> 00:03:57 >> They were in class.
00:03:57 --> 00:03:57 >> Mhm.
00:03:57 --> 00:03:59 >> They were They were reorganizing
00:03:59 --> 00:04:01 everything that they were doing to to
00:04:01 --> 00:04:04 stay ready. And now that it's Now that
00:04:04 --> 00:04:07 guns are firing, like they're they're
00:04:07 --> 00:04:08 really ready for it.
00:04:08 --> 00:04:11 >> Yeah, I love that. And I'm so glad to to
00:04:11 --> 00:04:12 hear that. And that was one of the
00:04:12 --> 00:04:15 things that I know that we like to teach
00:04:15 --> 00:04:17 over at the Avery agency is that Okay,
00:04:17 --> 00:04:20 so right now everything might be a
00:04:20 --> 00:04:21 little slow, but this is the time that
00:04:21 --> 00:04:24 you need to to hone everything in and
00:04:24 --> 00:04:27 and perfect as much as you can and and
00:04:27 --> 00:04:30 do all the things that you may have not
00:04:30 --> 00:04:32 had time for when everything was was
00:04:32 --> 00:04:35 booming like that, you know?
00:04:35 --> 00:04:36 >> Yeah, now you can just got to Now you
00:04:36 --> 00:04:37 just got to crush auditions.
00:04:38 --> 00:04:39 >> That's right.
00:04:39 --> 00:04:41 Now as the president and head of TV and
00:04:41 --> 00:04:43 film at AMT, you're looking at actors
00:04:43 --> 00:04:46 from an agent's perspective every day.
00:04:46 --> 00:04:49 So what makes someone jump out at you
00:04:49 --> 00:04:51 before they have the big resume or
00:04:51 --> 00:04:53 recognizable name?
00:04:53 --> 00:04:55 >> It's funny you say that because I was
00:04:55 --> 00:04:56 just having this conversation with
00:04:56 --> 00:04:59 people in in real life, too. Um I think
00:04:59 --> 00:05:01 there are two things that I that I
00:05:01 --> 00:05:03 really look for or that I notice right
00:05:03 --> 00:05:04 away.
00:05:04 --> 00:05:07 Um one is just extreme extreme unique
00:05:07 --> 00:05:08 talent.
00:05:09 --> 00:05:10 So what do I mean by that? I mean talent
00:05:10 --> 00:05:13 that is unique to something that I don't
00:05:13 --> 00:05:15 see all day every day.
00:05:15 --> 00:05:17 Uh something about it is memorable or
00:05:17 --> 00:05:19 interesting or quirky or different to
00:05:19 --> 00:05:20 me. It's unique.
00:05:20 --> 00:05:20 >> Yeah.
00:05:20 --> 00:05:22 >> Uh and also unique to my roster. So they
00:05:22 --> 00:05:24 are uniquely talented to people that are
00:05:24 --> 00:05:26 already in my life that I'm already
00:05:26 --> 00:05:28 working hard and trusting that I'm
00:05:28 --> 00:05:29 putting them
00:05:29 --> 00:05:30 forward first.
00:05:30 --> 00:05:30 >> Right.
00:05:30 --> 00:05:33 >> You know? So that uniquely talented
00:05:33 --> 00:05:35 person and then two,
00:05:35 --> 00:05:37 at this point in my career, I want to
00:05:37 --> 00:05:39 work with people who are genuinely kind.
00:05:40 --> 00:05:40 >> Mhm.
00:05:40 --> 00:05:43 >> And I know that that is a tall order,
00:05:43 --> 00:05:46 but it is one that that I absolutely
00:05:46 --> 00:05:47 love to fill
00:05:47 --> 00:05:47 >> Yeah.
00:05:47 --> 00:05:49 >> And to find because there's nothing
00:05:49 --> 00:05:52 better than stamping the AMT logo onto
00:05:52 --> 00:05:54 an actor's resume and sending them out
00:05:54 --> 00:05:56 into the world and just knowing that
00:05:56 --> 00:05:58 whoever they meet, they're going to
00:05:58 --> 00:06:00 they're going to impress with their
00:06:00 --> 00:06:02 chill, kind attitude.
00:06:02 --> 00:06:03 >> Yeah.
00:06:03 --> 00:06:06 >> And, you know, I know that, you know,
00:06:06 --> 00:06:08 we run into to tough clients all the
00:06:08 --> 00:06:10 time and, you know, situations where
00:06:10 --> 00:06:11 egos
00:06:11 --> 00:06:14 run, you know, run the the roost and all
00:06:14 --> 00:06:16 this crap, but
00:06:16 --> 00:06:17 at this point in my career, like, that's
00:06:17 --> 00:06:19 something I'm very adamant about is
00:06:19 --> 00:06:21 finding these people who are uniquely
00:06:21 --> 00:06:23 talented and they're just a good, kind
00:06:23 --> 00:06:25 person who needs help. And that's
00:06:25 --> 00:06:28 someone who I'm willing to bring on and
00:06:28 --> 00:06:30 hustle for for free until they make a
00:06:30 --> 00:06:30 dollar.
00:06:30 --> 00:06:33 >> Ooh, I love that. I love that. And it
00:06:33 --> 00:06:35 does make so much of a difference to
00:06:35 --> 00:06:38 work with someone that is genuine, you
00:06:38 --> 00:06:40 know, genuinely that way instead of
00:06:40 --> 00:06:43 always with opposition. You know what I
00:06:43 --> 00:06:44 mean?
00:06:44 --> 00:06:46 >> Yeah, I mean, in a way, clients can make
00:06:46 --> 00:06:48 our lives easier. You know, they can
00:06:48 --> 00:06:49 certainly make it harder, but they can
00:06:49 --> 00:06:50 also make it easier.
00:06:51 --> 00:06:54 >> Yeah. Yeah. Now, actors hear so much
00:06:54 --> 00:06:55 advice, okay? They always hear, "Get new
00:06:55 --> 00:06:58 headshots. Take another class. Post
00:06:58 --> 00:07:00 more. Network more. Get more footage."
00:07:00 --> 00:07:02 What do you think actors spend way too
00:07:02 --> 00:07:06 much time worrying about or what should
00:07:06 --> 00:07:08 they be worrying about?
00:07:08 --> 00:07:12 >> That's a great question. I think actors
00:07:12 --> 00:07:14 spend a lot of time worrying about who's
00:07:14 --> 00:07:16 going to get the audition that they're
00:07:16 --> 00:07:17 auditioning for.
00:07:17 --> 00:07:18 >> Ooh, yeah.
00:07:18 --> 00:07:20 >> And I don't think I've ever said that on
00:07:20 --> 00:07:22 a podcast or at a showcase or panel or
00:07:22 --> 00:07:23 anything, but I I really think it's
00:07:23 --> 00:07:25 true. I think
00:07:25 --> 00:07:27 there are very famous phrases around
00:07:27 --> 00:07:29 the, you know, the line along the lines
00:07:29 --> 00:07:31 of like, "Do the audition and then
00:07:31 --> 00:07:32 forget about it."
00:07:32 --> 00:07:33 >> Yeah.
00:07:33 --> 00:07:34 >> You know, everybody loves to talk about
00:07:34 --> 00:07:36 that, but how many people actually
00:07:36 --> 00:07:38 preach and practice that? I feel like
00:07:38 --> 00:07:41 very few. I think most people are very
00:07:41 --> 00:07:42 concerned with how many people they're
00:07:42 --> 00:07:44 up against, who else they might be up
00:07:44 --> 00:07:45 against, who's their competition for
00:07:45 --> 00:07:46 their this role.
00:07:46 --> 00:07:48 Are they going to stand out? Did they
00:07:48 --> 00:07:50 make the right choice? Is it already
00:07:50 --> 00:07:52 cast? Is it going to a name? Like
00:07:52 --> 00:07:54 there's just so many things that people
00:07:54 --> 00:07:57 worry about other than just
00:07:57 --> 00:07:58 doing the best they can and actually
00:07:58 --> 00:07:59 moving on.
00:07:59 --> 00:08:02 >> Yeah, because I mean it's there's no way
00:08:02 --> 00:08:05 that you can predict who who's going to
00:08:05 --> 00:08:07 audition before you, how they did,
00:08:07 --> 00:08:08 whether they did well or whether they
00:08:09 --> 00:08:10 they didn't do that great, who's better
00:08:10 --> 00:08:12 than you, who has your look. I mean,
00:08:12 --> 00:08:14 that First of all, that's a lot of
00:08:14 --> 00:08:15 pressure.
00:08:15 --> 00:08:17 >> Right.
00:08:17 --> 00:08:17 >> [laughter]
00:08:17 --> 00:08:20 >> That's a lot of pressure, but it's also,
00:08:20 --> 00:08:23 you know, it can be just stressful in
00:08:23 --> 00:08:25 general instead of just going in there
00:08:25 --> 00:08:27 and do the very best that you yourself
00:08:27 --> 00:08:29 can can do, correct?
00:08:29 --> 00:08:33 >> Correct. It's a lot of time spent, and
00:08:33 --> 00:08:35 time is precious.
00:08:35 --> 00:08:35 >> That's right.
00:08:35 --> 00:08:37 >> You know, all of that precious time
00:08:37 --> 00:08:39 could be spent another way that
00:08:39 --> 00:08:41 absolutely brings fruitful, positive
00:08:41 --> 00:08:42 time and energy.
00:08:42 --> 00:08:45 >> Absolutely. Absolutely. Now, let's talk
00:08:45 --> 00:08:46 about something that I know that you're
00:08:47 --> 00:08:49 excited about because I've seen some of
00:08:49 --> 00:08:50 your posts and I know that you've been
00:08:51 --> 00:08:53 excited about this, the vertical
00:08:53 --> 00:08:54 division.
00:08:54 --> 00:08:56 So, what made you guys decide that this
00:08:56 --> 00:08:57 was important enough to create a
00:08:57 --> 00:08:59 dedicated division instead of treating
00:08:59 --> 00:09:02 vertical projects as just another
00:09:02 --> 00:09:04 passing trend?
00:09:04 --> 00:09:06 >> Um well, it really did kind of start
00:09:06 --> 00:09:08 small and it was kind of annoying cuz we
00:09:08 --> 00:09:10 were doing all the big budget stuff.
00:09:10 --> 00:09:11 Then it was like, who wants to work on
00:09:11 --> 00:09:13 something for 200 a day or less, you
00:09:13 --> 00:09:15 know, not us. Nobody did. But then as
00:09:15 --> 00:09:17 things got really slow, it was kind of
00:09:17 --> 00:09:18 like, well, what am I supposed to do?
00:09:18 --> 00:09:20 Everyone's hungry, I'm hungry. There's
00:09:20 --> 00:09:23 all this random cheap food out there.
00:09:23 --> 00:09:25 You know, like, should we go should we
00:09:25 --> 00:09:26 go taste it? And we're like, taste it.
00:09:26 --> 00:09:28 We're like, well, it
00:09:28 --> 00:09:30 it's kind of fulfilling.
00:09:30 --> 00:09:32 Um let's look for the positives in this
00:09:32 --> 00:09:34 because it's in abundance. And so that's
00:09:34 --> 00:09:36 what we did. We looked for the positives
00:09:36 --> 00:09:38 in it. And there were a lot of good
00:09:38 --> 00:09:40 people behind the scenes and some
00:09:40 --> 00:09:42 like-minded conversations. And so we
00:09:42 --> 00:09:44 said, "Let's just give this a shot and
00:09:44 --> 00:09:47 see what we can do." And we have I can
00:09:47 --> 00:09:49 say that it's been a really positive
00:09:49 --> 00:09:50 adventure. You know, we've learned a
00:09:50 --> 00:09:53 lot. We we've definitely um
00:09:53 --> 00:09:56 put our our foot down on some
00:09:56 --> 00:09:58 contractual issues that we didn't think
00:09:58 --> 00:10:00 were strong or comfortable or protecting
00:10:00 --> 00:10:02 the actor. And so that was some good
00:10:02 --> 00:10:04 That was some good progress. And we we
00:10:04 --> 00:10:06 met a lot of really great actors that we
00:10:07 --> 00:10:08 might not have brought onto the roster
00:10:08 --> 00:10:12 because our roster was full. Um but they
00:10:12 --> 00:10:14 were really sweet and lovely and wanted
00:10:14 --> 00:10:15 to get in through this division and it
00:10:15 --> 00:10:17 was a really cool way to kind of like
00:10:17 --> 00:10:19 get their feet in. And I really like
00:10:19 --> 00:10:21 some of these new clients and and I'm
00:10:21 --> 00:10:23 rooting for them and watching them taste
00:10:23 --> 00:10:24 success.
00:10:24 --> 00:10:24 >> Right.
00:10:24 --> 00:10:26 >> All that being said that, you know,
00:10:26 --> 00:10:29 the vertical micro drama
00:10:29 --> 00:10:32 series as a whole seems to be slowing
00:10:32 --> 00:10:35 down a lot except for the Los Angeles
00:10:35 --> 00:10:35 market.
00:10:36 --> 00:10:36 >> Right.
00:10:36 --> 00:10:37 >> And seems to be,
00:10:38 --> 00:10:40 you know, replaced by AI is kind of
00:10:40 --> 00:10:41 happening.
00:10:41 --> 00:10:42 >> And that's something.
00:10:42 --> 00:10:43 >> So.
00:10:43 --> 00:10:44 So I don't know how how fruitful it's
00:10:44 --> 00:10:46 going to be in the future. Um but it was
00:10:46 --> 00:10:48 it's been nothing but a a really
00:10:48 --> 00:10:50 educational and positive experience for
00:10:50 --> 00:10:51 us.
00:10:51 --> 00:10:53 >> Well, that's also coming from, you know,
00:10:53 --> 00:10:56 the agent standpoint. But as for actors
00:10:56 --> 00:10:59 who still not quite sure where verticals
00:10:59 --> 00:11:02 fit into their career, what would you
00:11:02 --> 00:11:03 want them to understand about the
00:11:03 --> 00:11:06 opportunities, the money, you know, and
00:11:06 --> 00:11:09 that may be in that space?
00:11:09 --> 00:11:10 >> Well, what I think's interesting about
00:11:10 --> 00:11:13 that space is that it's a very specific
00:11:13 --> 00:11:16 medium. You know, it's kind of um
00:11:16 --> 00:11:18 melodramatic, a little soapy, a lot of
00:11:18 --> 00:11:21 that acting, and a lot of tropes.
00:11:21 --> 00:11:23 Um but what's cool about it is they they
00:11:23 --> 00:11:26 don't care what you've done, you know,
00:11:26 --> 00:11:27 as an actor. They don't care about your
00:11:27 --> 00:11:28 resume. They're going to let you read
00:11:28 --> 00:11:30 for the lead if you look like the lead.
00:11:30 --> 00:11:31 Or they're going to let you read for a
00:11:31 --> 00:11:34 role that works six days.
00:11:34 --> 00:11:36 You know, and I saw a lot of actors on
00:11:36 --> 00:11:38 our roster who auditioned for big stuff
00:11:38 --> 00:11:41 for years and eventually book one line,
00:11:41 --> 00:11:43 you know, eventually book two lines, and
00:11:43 --> 00:11:44 here they're playing the President of
00:11:44 --> 00:11:45 the United States.
00:11:45 --> 00:11:45 >> Yeah.
00:11:45 --> 00:11:47 >> Working five days, and and maybe they're
00:11:47 --> 00:11:49 only making 350 bucks a day, but they're
00:11:49 --> 00:11:52 making 350 bucks a day times five days
00:11:52 --> 00:11:54 doing something they love to do in a big
00:11:54 --> 00:11:56 role, and it's not just like theater
00:11:56 --> 00:11:57 down the street.
00:11:57 --> 00:11:57 >> That's right.
00:11:57 --> 00:11:59 >> You know, it's still in that medium of
00:11:59 --> 00:12:02 film and television, and I've seen a lot
00:12:02 --> 00:12:04 of actors have a really good time
00:12:04 --> 00:12:06 digging their claws into these fun
00:12:06 --> 00:12:08 characters, and kind of getting to play
00:12:08 --> 00:12:10 as an artist with no worries.
00:12:10 --> 00:12:13 >> Well, that also gives them a lot of
00:12:13 --> 00:12:16 experience and and even more practice
00:12:16 --> 00:12:18 for something that's going to come
00:12:18 --> 00:12:20 bigger because that now they have that
00:12:20 --> 00:12:23 opportunity to to sink their teeth into
00:12:23 --> 00:12:25 something they probably
00:12:25 --> 00:12:26 thought that maybe they wouldn't have
00:12:26 --> 00:12:30 gotten any, you know, any way else.
00:12:30 --> 00:12:31 >> Mhm.
00:12:31 --> 00:12:33 >> Exactly. Exactly.
00:12:33 --> 00:12:34 >> And so,
00:12:34 --> 00:12:36 I wanted to get into definitely wanted
00:12:36 --> 00:12:38 to get into the book that you wrote, Ask
00:12:38 --> 00:12:40 an Agent, and you've done more than
00:12:40 --> 00:12:43 you've done that more than 100 episodes
00:12:43 --> 00:12:46 of Talent Agent Talk. So, clearly you've
00:12:46 --> 00:12:48 heard just about every actor question
00:12:48 --> 00:12:50 imaginable. So, what's something actors
00:12:51 --> 00:12:54 still seem to misunderstand about the
00:12:54 --> 00:12:56 actor-agent
00:12:56 --> 00:13:01 relationship in your opinion?
00:13:01 --> 00:13:04 >> I I think a lot of actors still do
00:13:04 --> 00:13:05 still do
00:13:05 --> 00:13:06 um
00:13:06 --> 00:13:08 they put an agent
00:13:08 --> 00:13:11 into a lot of
00:13:13 --> 00:13:17 important positions in their world.
00:13:17 --> 00:13:20 And by doing that, it can be stressful
00:13:20 --> 00:13:23 on the agent a little bit. Um I don't
00:13:23 --> 00:13:24 feel like that really happens with our
00:13:24 --> 00:13:26 clients anymore because we've been so
00:13:26 --> 00:13:29 transparent
00:13:29 --> 00:13:31 in a parental kind of warm way.
00:13:31 --> 00:13:35 Um but I do think, you know, for my for
00:13:35 --> 00:13:36 my time in evol-
00:13:36 --> 00:13:39 my evolution as an agent,
00:13:39 --> 00:13:42 um I used to really feel like I was
00:13:42 --> 00:13:45 their therapist and their lawyer and
00:13:45 --> 00:13:47 their publicist.
00:13:47 --> 00:13:50 And those are three separate careers and
00:13:50 --> 00:13:52 three separate salaries and three
00:13:52 --> 00:13:54 separate, you know, that including the
00:13:54 --> 00:13:56 agent, that's four separate
00:13:56 --> 00:13:58 you know, um
00:13:58 --> 00:14:00 avenues of of payment that a human
00:14:00 --> 00:14:02 should have if you're hiring all of
00:14:02 --> 00:14:04 these kinds of people, not just put it
00:14:04 --> 00:14:06 all into one who works for free on
00:14:06 --> 00:14:07 commission only.
00:14:07 --> 00:14:08 >> Right.
00:14:08 --> 00:14:09 >> Um
00:14:09 --> 00:14:11 so I think that's one of the biggest
00:14:11 --> 00:14:13 things that I I think actors could
00:14:13 --> 00:14:16 educate themselves even more on
00:14:16 --> 00:14:19 SAG-AFTRA rules and behind-the-scenes
00:14:20 --> 00:14:22 information so that they aren't relying
00:14:22 --> 00:14:24 on anyone other than
00:14:25 --> 00:14:29 themselves to run their business and or
00:14:29 --> 00:14:32 research and and knowledge and study,
00:14:32 --> 00:14:35 you know. Uh so that would be like my my
00:14:35 --> 00:14:36 biggest thing. That's one of the things
00:14:36 --> 00:14:38 that I I love when I I meet a new actor
00:14:39 --> 00:14:40 who wants to get into the agency and
00:14:40 --> 00:14:41 they mention my book and that they read
00:14:41 --> 00:14:43 my book and I already think, "Wow, like
00:14:43 --> 00:14:46 at least you understand how I work."
00:14:46 --> 00:14:46 >> Yeah.
00:14:47 --> 00:14:49 >> Because if we're going to work together,
00:14:49 --> 00:14:50 I have a very short period of time here
00:14:50 --> 00:14:51 to zoom with you and try to figure out
00:14:51 --> 00:14:53 if I think I'm going to be a good fit
00:14:53 --> 00:14:54 for you, but maybe you'll know if we're
00:14:54 --> 00:14:56 a good fit in advance.
00:14:56 --> 00:14:58 >> Yeah. Yeah, I love that. Now, you
00:14:58 --> 00:15:01 represent talent through some major
00:15:01 --> 00:15:04 changes in this business. What's if in
00:15:04 --> 00:15:07 your opinion, what's an old school, I
00:15:07 --> 00:15:10 guess old school industry rule or piece
00:15:10 --> 00:15:13 or piece of career advice that you think
00:15:13 --> 00:15:18 just doesn't work anymore?
00:15:18 --> 00:15:22 >> Um what doesn't work anymore?
00:15:22 --> 00:15:24 I mean, people can hate me for saying
00:15:24 --> 00:15:26 this, but like, I think it's really hard
00:15:26 --> 00:15:29 to be like,
00:15:29 --> 00:15:32 you know, I'm guest star only.
00:15:32 --> 00:15:34 I think if you've been a series regular,
00:15:34 --> 00:15:35 >> Yeah.
00:15:35 --> 00:15:37 >> sure. You know, if if you've made a
00:15:37 --> 00:15:39 million dollar, even if you've made a
00:15:39 --> 00:15:41 couple hundred thousand as an actor and
00:15:41 --> 00:15:42 you want to be like, I'm guest star
00:15:42 --> 00:15:43 only.
00:15:43 --> 00:15:46 Um, but if you haven't worked in 2 years
00:15:46 --> 00:15:48 and you've only made $40 as an actor
00:15:48 --> 00:15:49 total,
00:15:50 --> 00:15:51 like, because you've got three co-stars
00:15:51 --> 00:15:53 and you're you're now guest star only
00:15:53 --> 00:15:55 and that is how you're going to get to
00:15:55 --> 00:15:58 guest star, I think that is the
00:15:58 --> 00:15:59 old-school mentality.
00:15:59 --> 00:16:00 >> Got it.
00:16:00 --> 00:16:01 >> There's nothing wrong with being guest
00:16:01 --> 00:16:03 star only.
00:16:03 --> 00:16:04 I think I think the old-school
00:16:04 --> 00:16:06 mentality, that's what it is. It's
00:16:06 --> 00:16:07 saying, I'm going to be guest star only
00:16:07 --> 00:16:09 until I book a guest star.
00:16:09 --> 00:16:11 >> Yeah. Yeah.
00:16:11 --> 00:16:12 >> I just don't think that's the way it
00:16:12 --> 00:16:14 works anymore.
00:16:14 --> 00:16:17 There's not enough food out there
00:16:18 --> 00:16:20 to be able to say, I only eat filet
00:16:20 --> 00:16:21 mignon.
00:16:21 --> 00:16:23 >> Right. Right. Right. And you got it.
00:16:23 --> 00:16:25 Sometimes you just got to eat something
00:16:25 --> 00:16:27 else, T-bone.
00:16:27 --> 00:16:29 >> There's There's some other really good
00:16:29 --> 00:16:30 stuff out there that will keep you alive
00:16:31 --> 00:16:32 and then you'll absolutely get that
00:16:32 --> 00:16:34 filet, you know, because you'll be
00:16:34 --> 00:16:35 well-fed as opposed to all the other
00:16:35 --> 00:16:37 people who are still starving.
00:16:37 --> 00:16:40 >> Yeah. Yeah. So true. Now, you have
00:16:40 --> 00:16:42 accomplished so much in your career,
00:16:42 --> 00:16:44 both in the creative side, the business
00:16:44 --> 00:16:46 sides of entertainment. Are you working
00:16:46 --> 00:16:48 on anything right now that you're
00:16:48 --> 00:16:50 excited about personally? Not just
00:16:50 --> 00:16:53 president of the agency, but but Jason
00:16:53 --> 00:16:55 himself.
00:16:55 --> 00:16:57 >> Um, I did get to kind of take like a
00:16:57 --> 00:16:59 6-week mini sabbatical this year and
00:16:59 --> 00:17:00 direct a feature film.
00:17:00 --> 00:17:01 >> Oh, nice.
00:17:01 --> 00:17:04 >> And that was, um,
00:17:04 --> 00:17:07 it started with a very very bizarre text
00:17:07 --> 00:17:10 message that led to a phone call
00:17:10 --> 00:17:12 and I I threw my hat in the ring and I
00:17:12 --> 00:17:14 interviewed like everybody else and they
00:17:14 --> 00:17:15 were crazy enough to to me, so I went
00:17:15 --> 00:17:17 and did it.
00:17:17 --> 00:17:18 And um
00:17:18 --> 00:17:20 it was a it was quite the challenge, but
00:17:21 --> 00:17:23 it was uh to do that and balance AMT and
00:17:23 --> 00:17:26 balance everything else in the world.
00:17:26 --> 00:17:27 But it's really great to wear a
00:17:27 --> 00:17:29 different hat in this industry for even
00:17:29 --> 00:17:31 a short phase, you know, for a short
00:17:31 --> 00:17:33 chapter, cuz it just makes you
00:17:33 --> 00:17:35 appreciate all of the other chapters and
00:17:36 --> 00:17:37 all of the other people. And then I just
00:17:37 --> 00:17:38 love
00:17:38 --> 00:17:40 you know, I just love that I get to get
00:17:40 --> 00:17:42 up every day and help actors get onto
00:17:42 --> 00:17:44 sets knowing what it was like to be one
00:17:44 --> 00:17:45 on myself for 6 straight weeks.
00:17:45 --> 00:17:48 >> Yeah. I love that, too.
00:17:48 --> 00:17:51 Now, you spent more than 25 years
00:17:51 --> 00:17:52 watching people try to build their
00:17:52 --> 00:17:54 careers in the industry. When you see
00:17:54 --> 00:17:56 somebody that's actually making the
00:17:56 --> 00:17:59 transition from trying to become a
00:17:59 --> 00:18:02 working actor to really having a career,
00:18:02 --> 00:18:05 what usually change for them in in your
00:18:05 --> 00:18:07 opinion?
00:18:07 --> 00:18:08 >> Part of it is just their confidence,
00:18:08 --> 00:18:10 which usually comes with that first like
00:18:10 --> 00:18:12 booking or two.
00:18:12 --> 00:18:13 We see these really talented people come
00:18:13 --> 00:18:15 in with these great headshots and a reel
00:18:15 --> 00:18:17 filled with student films and web series
00:18:17 --> 00:18:19 or whatever, and they just they're
00:18:19 --> 00:18:21 auditioning for like 6, 7 months, but no
00:18:21 --> 00:18:23 big network, you know, or streamer has
00:18:23 --> 00:18:24 hired them.
00:18:24 --> 00:18:27 And desperation starts to crawl in and I
00:18:27 --> 00:18:29 don't know what happens. They just they
00:18:29 --> 00:18:31 start to not believe that they can do it
00:18:31 --> 00:18:33 or that why are they doing this?
00:18:33 --> 00:18:34 >> Right.
00:18:34 --> 00:18:37 >> But then I see this huge shift.
00:18:37 --> 00:18:40 And it's when people start to book two,
00:18:40 --> 00:18:43 three little jobs. All of the sudden
00:18:43 --> 00:18:45 their auditions look better because they
00:18:45 --> 00:18:48 look easier and it's this quiet
00:18:48 --> 00:18:49 confidence that they have. They're not
00:18:49 --> 00:18:51 cocky. They don't think they're suddenly
00:18:51 --> 00:18:53 a star. They just like, "Okay, this does
00:18:53 --> 00:18:55 pay off sometimes."
00:18:55 --> 00:18:56 >> Yeah. Yeah.
00:18:56 --> 00:18:57 >> You know?
00:18:57 --> 00:18:59 And what's interesting is people will
00:18:59 --> 00:19:01 say all the time like and they'll say to
00:19:01 --> 00:19:03 me and their agent like
00:19:03 --> 00:19:04 "I've got this booking and it's coming
00:19:04 --> 00:19:05 out. Like how do we use this as
00:19:05 --> 00:19:07 momentum?"
00:19:07 --> 00:19:09 And it's like they've got two lines on
00:19:09 --> 00:19:10 an HBO show.
00:19:10 --> 00:19:10 >> Yeah.
00:19:10 --> 00:19:12 >> "How do we use this as momentum?"
00:19:12 --> 00:19:14 I can tell every casting director in the
00:19:14 --> 00:19:17 world this actor has two lines on this
00:19:17 --> 00:19:19 new HBO show, so you should hire them
00:19:19 --> 00:19:21 immediately on something else.
00:19:21 --> 00:19:22 >> Mhm.
00:19:22 --> 00:19:24 >> And that's just not the way that
00:19:24 --> 00:19:25 momentum actually works.
00:19:25 --> 00:19:26 >> Right.
00:19:26 --> 00:19:29 >> I think actors often compare momentum
00:19:29 --> 00:19:32 with that of like an A-list star. Like
00:19:32 --> 00:19:35 the lead in Obsession now has momentum
00:19:35 --> 00:19:37 because Obsession was such a big deal.
00:19:37 --> 00:19:39 She has real momentum
00:19:39 --> 00:19:40 >> Right.
00:19:40 --> 00:19:42 >> to book something else offer only with a
00:19:42 --> 00:19:44 good price tag.
00:19:44 --> 00:19:45 >> Yes.
00:19:45 --> 00:19:47 >> But if you're not talking at that level
00:19:47 --> 00:19:49 of momentum
00:19:49 --> 00:19:52 here's the secret, actors.
00:19:52 --> 00:19:55 You create that momentum yourself.
00:19:55 --> 00:19:56 >> Yeah.
00:19:56 --> 00:19:58 >> And it's just really I've just booked
00:19:58 --> 00:20:02 two three times. How do I have momentum?
00:20:02 --> 00:20:04 Your artistry is thriving. Your
00:20:04 --> 00:20:06 positivity is vibrating really high.
00:20:06 --> 00:20:08 You're really happy with every audition.
00:20:08 --> 00:20:10 You believe in yourself more than you
00:20:10 --> 00:20:11 ever had.
00:20:11 --> 00:20:14 That is creating your own momentum.
00:20:14 --> 00:20:14 >> Mhm.
00:20:14 --> 00:20:16 >> And sometimes that does happen after
00:20:16 --> 00:20:18 like two bookings. But how Going back to
00:20:18 --> 00:20:21 really answer your question, Demetria
00:20:21 --> 00:20:22 that's how.
00:20:22 --> 00:20:23 >> Yeah.
00:20:23 --> 00:20:24 >> How how are how are the actors
00:20:24 --> 00:20:26 consistently doing it? I think they are
00:20:26 --> 00:20:28 creating their own momentum.
00:20:28 --> 00:20:30 >> I love that. That's going to be a great
00:20:30 --> 00:20:32 sound bite, so we going to keep that.
00:20:32 --> 00:20:34 >> [laughter]
00:20:34 --> 00:20:36 >> I love it. I love it. Now, Jason, it is
00:20:36 --> 00:20:39 time for a little bit of fun. We have a
00:20:39 --> 00:20:43 game we call yes, no, it depends.
00:20:43 --> 00:20:46 So, when I ask a question, you have to
00:20:46 --> 00:20:48 either say yes, no, or it depends. You
00:20:48 --> 00:20:50 can't think too hard on it though, okay?
00:20:50 --> 00:20:51 >> Okay.
00:20:51 --> 00:20:52 >> All right.
00:20:52 --> 00:20:55 The first question. An actor absolutely
00:20:55 --> 00:20:57 kills the audition, then realizes
00:20:57 --> 00:21:00 they've been confidently calling the
00:21:00 --> 00:21:03 cast casting director by the wrong name.
00:21:03 --> 00:21:07 Can the audition still uh save them?
00:21:07 --> 00:21:09 >> I can say yes, no, or what?
00:21:09 --> 00:21:12 >> It depends.
00:21:13 --> 00:21:15 >> [laughter]
00:21:15 --> 00:21:18 >> It depends. Okay.
00:21:18 --> 00:21:20 An actor books a role and immediately
00:21:20 --> 00:21:23 starts acting like they officially made
00:21:23 --> 00:21:24 it.
00:21:24 --> 00:21:26 Do you let them enjoy the moment before
00:21:26 --> 00:21:29 bringing them back to Earth?
00:21:29 --> 00:21:30 >> Yeah.
00:21:31 --> 00:21:32 Enjoy that moment. Go ahead and
00:21:32 --> 00:21:34 >> Yeah, go ahead and enjoy it. That's
00:21:34 --> 00:21:36 fine.
00:21:36 --> 00:21:38 >> Okay. Your client gets off of a role
00:21:38 --> 00:21:41 they really don't like, but the paycheck
00:21:41 --> 00:21:42 is nice.
00:21:42 --> 00:21:46 Take the money and run?
00:21:46 --> 00:21:47 >> It depends.
00:21:48 --> 00:21:49 >> [laughter]
00:21:49 --> 00:21:50 >> Yeah, it depends how much money, it
00:21:51 --> 00:21:51 depends on
00:21:51 --> 00:21:52 >> money it is.
00:21:52 --> 00:21:53 >> who you're working with, what doors
00:21:53 --> 00:21:55 could this open, what else do you got
00:21:55 --> 00:21:58 going on. It depends on a lot.
00:21:58 --> 00:22:00 >> Okay. An actor gets a callback while
00:22:00 --> 00:22:02 they're on vacation and their audition
00:22:02 --> 00:22:04 is due in 3 hours.
00:22:04 --> 00:22:07 Are they finding a blank wall
00:22:07 --> 00:22:10 or um making it happen?
00:22:10 --> 00:22:12 >> Yeah. They're They're finding a blank
00:22:12 --> 00:22:13 wall and making it happen. Yes.
00:22:13 --> 00:22:16 >> Yeah.
00:22:16 --> 00:22:18 Okay, just a few more. You're watching a
00:22:18 --> 00:22:20 movie and one of your actors pops up on
00:22:20 --> 00:22:21 the screen,
00:22:21 --> 00:22:24 but they never told you they booked it.
00:22:24 --> 00:22:25 Are we having a conversation Monday
00:22:25 --> 00:22:26 morning?
00:22:26 --> 00:22:27 >> Yes.
00:22:29 --> 00:22:29 >> [laughter]
00:22:29 --> 00:22:30 >> I bet.
00:22:30 --> 00:22:32 Cuz I want that conversation going to be
00:22:32 --> 00:22:34 like, right?
00:22:35 --> 00:22:37 Okay. Your client gets recognized in
00:22:37 --> 00:22:39 public for the very first time and
00:22:39 --> 00:22:41 suddenly wants to start wearing
00:22:41 --> 00:22:44 sunglasses indoors. Do you humble them
00:22:44 --> 00:22:46 immediately?
00:22:46 --> 00:22:47 >> No. Let them.
00:22:47 --> 00:22:48 >> Let them go ahead and do that.
00:22:48 --> 00:22:50 >> Let them wear those sunglasses. Let them
00:22:50 --> 00:22:52 wear anything they want to wear. They
00:22:52 --> 00:22:53 deserve it.
00:22:53 --> 00:22:57 >> Feel the moment. Feel the moment.
00:22:57 --> 00:22:57 Okay.
00:22:57 --> 00:22:58 >> I know it I know it ain't bright in
00:22:58 --> 00:22:59 here.
00:22:59 --> 00:23:00 >> Right.
00:23:00 --> 00:23:00 >> [laughter]
00:23:00 --> 00:23:01 >> But you look cool.
00:23:01 --> 00:23:04 >> But you look Right. Okay, final one and
00:23:04 --> 00:23:06 this is about you.
00:23:06 --> 00:23:08 You get an offer tomorrow to step back
00:23:08 --> 00:23:10 in front of the camera for a great role,
00:23:10 --> 00:23:12 but it means leaving the agent desk for
00:23:12 --> 00:23:15 a few months. Are we getting acting
00:23:15 --> 00:23:17 Jason back?
00:23:17 --> 00:23:19 >> Hard no.
00:23:19 --> 00:23:20 >> [laughter]
00:23:20 --> 00:23:22 >> I've done some fun cameos for friends.
00:23:22 --> 00:23:24 It is torturous. I'm always just
00:23:25 --> 00:23:26 paranoid I'm going to [ __ ] up or
00:23:26 --> 00:23:29 whatever. My heart goes out to actors.
00:23:29 --> 00:23:32 It is not easy to memorize lines, to to
00:23:32 --> 00:23:35 be believable, to hit marks,
00:23:35 --> 00:23:37 you know, to like carry the backpack on
00:23:37 --> 00:23:38 the right shoulder, remember where you
00:23:38 --> 00:23:41 set it down. It is not easy. My heart
00:23:41 --> 00:23:43 goes out to them and it is hard it is
00:23:43 --> 00:23:45 hard work and that is why the big bucks
00:23:45 --> 00:23:46 are there for those who do it well.
00:23:46 --> 00:23:48 >> Yeah, that's right. That's right. I'm
00:23:48 --> 00:23:50 with you on that. I well, I could never
00:23:50 --> 00:23:52 act anyway. I am not an actress. I can I
00:23:52 --> 00:23:54 can read very well, so I can read what's
00:23:54 --> 00:23:57 going on, but the whole memorizing or we
00:23:57 --> 00:23:59 would be stuck on the first line
00:23:59 --> 00:24:01 forever, so
00:24:01 --> 00:24:01 >> [laughter]
00:24:01 --> 00:24:03 >> that's not going to work, but Jason,
00:24:03 --> 00:24:06 thank you so much. You survived. Yes,
00:24:06 --> 00:24:08 no, it depends. Thank you so much for
00:24:08 --> 00:24:10 hanging out with me today and giving us
00:24:10 --> 00:24:12 a look into the industry from your
00:24:12 --> 00:24:14 perspective from the agent side of the
00:24:14 --> 00:24:17 table. It's truly been a absolute
00:24:17 --> 00:24:18 pleasure.
00:24:18 --> 00:24:20 >> Well, thanks for having me. I I love
00:24:20 --> 00:24:21 your energy. I love your show. I'm happy
00:24:22 --> 00:24:22 to be here.
00:24:22 --> 00:24:24 >> Oh, thank you so much and everybody
00:24:24 --> 00:24:26 watching, make sure you like, subscribe
00:24:26 --> 00:24:28 and follow The Damier Avery Show The
00:24:28 --> 00:24:30 Industry. We'll see you next time. Talk
00:24:30 --> 00:28:47 to you later. Goodbye.
00:28:47 --> 00:28:49 >> Mhm.