What Love Never Looks Like: Domestic Violence, Interpersonal Violence, and the Courage to Heal

Dr. Carmela Maxell: Welcome back to another episode of Rooted in Rising with Dr. Carmela Maxell. I am your host today, and I have an amazing guest with me, Miss Rita Cartwright. Miss Rita is an author, entrepreneur, advocate, and founder of Go Beyond the Limit, where she empowers survivors of domestic violence through trauma-informed support and entrepreneurship. Her advocacy is deeply informed by her own experiences as a survivor. Today isn't simply a conversation about domestic violence. It's a conversation about power, control, fear, survival, healing, and the possibility of rebuilding a life after someone has tried to convince you that you no longer deserve one. Miss Cartwright, Miss Rita, I'm so blessed to have you here. she's hailing. From the great state of Arizona, please let our listeners know a little bit about you. And yeah, just tell us a little bit about yourself. Rita Cartwright: Hi everyone. as Dr. Maxel said, Dr. Carmela mentioned she said a lot about me already, and so I see if I can fill in the blanks. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: I've been an entrepreneur since 2002, and that is as the result of being fired from Sears, and I couldn't find another job. And I was older when I did this career change because I was able to go back to school at 40 years old. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Okay. Rita Cartwright: and so I attended Arizona State University and praise God I graduated with honors and so I received a degree in marketing. And so that was Dr. Carmela Maxell: Okay. Rita Cartwright: my that was my career change was marketing. And so I was Going out pounding the pavement with my new degree. I have been a word processor specialist in the provost and and president offices of the university. And so just giving you a little background about me, so Sears did hire me to be a manager of their men's department. And if there are any wives in the audience, you know, men rarely shop for themselves and so it's like an the underwear had to be full of holes before they go buy a Dr. Carmela Maxell: What? Rita Cartwright: a new a new pair. And so needless to say I couldn't bring up the they they hired me into a sh a sinking ship. And so needless to say my assignment was to bring up the sales results and and I couldn't so they fired me. and so anyways I pounded the pavement with my new degree, looking for a new job in the marketing department of some corporation. But like they said, tell God your plans if you want to make him laugh. That was my plans to work for another company. And so after a while, after I couldn't get hired anywhere else after being fired from Sears, I decided to, well God let me. to launch my own business. And I did that in 2002. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Woohoo. That is amazing. Rita Cartwright: And like Carmela mentioned, I that is my for profit business at Digital Marketing Services. And I launched another business in twenty nineteen. And this is this is my heart, my passion. And this is go beyond the limit. And I launched Dr. Carmela Maxell: Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Rita Cartwright: it, it's an organization that teaches women survivors of domestic violence how to become online entrepreneurs. And those classes are free. Those classes are Dr. Carmela Maxell: that is amazing. That is amazing. Rita Cartwright: are free. So if there is anyone in the listening audience that would be interested in that and you fit that role as a survivor of domestic violence, Dr. Carmela, she will provide the contact information Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes, I will. Rita Cartwright: for you to get in touch with me. And so that that's me in a nutshell. I am an entrepreneur, like I said, for like twenty-four years now as of October one. I am a survivor of domestic violence, twice. Two relationships. I went through it twice. And therefore, that's why my assignment by God is to be an advocate for these ladies. I'm a mother, a grandmother, a great grandmother. And my great granddaughter just had a baby. She's twenty-two. So now Dr. Carmela Maxell: Congratulations. Rita Cartwright: I am a great great grandma. Dr. Carmela Maxell: All the babies. We love this. We love this. Miss Rita, you are doing some phenomenal work, Rita Cartwright: Ha ha Dr. Carmela Maxell: and I can't wait for I'm gonna I'm gonna get on everybody. You get in touch with Miss Rita and and utilize these services. We're gonna push this out. This is absolutely amazing. Thank you so much for what you do. for women, you know, for women of color, for survivors. Thank you, thank you, thank you in advance for for all you do. Rita Cartwright: glory to God. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Well, so I wanna start with this. tell us who Miss Rita was before domestic violence entered your life. Rita Cartwright: Well, I my mom left my dad when I was two years old. So I ended up being raised by a single parent. And I had that missing he was in my life, but not as one that would mold Dr. Carmela Maxell: Like active. Rita Cartwright: me and shape me into who, you know, I'm supposed to be as an adult. That was all my mom. And so w without my dad being present in my life on a consistent basis, that left this hole in my heart where I sought love all in the wrong places. And this is what Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm, so relatable. Rita Cartwright: and this is what led to me choosing these relationships that ended up being violent. Where I suffered domestic violence. like I said, I was searching for love all in the wrong places. So as you asked who was I before the violence started, I guess I was already coming from a broken place. Although I was being raised in church, my mom she did very well for us as as a as a single parent. She did she did very well as I look back on my life. She did very well for us. Although we didn't appreciate it as kids, but as I look back, Dr. Carmela Maxell: Just kids, yeah. Rita Cartwright: she she did an awesome job. And that's who I was. I like I said, I was a little church girl. However, I did have issues because of this missing puzzle piece in my life. And it left a hole in my soul. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. And I want to normalize that. You know, I I am a person who has experienced you know relationships that were were verbally abusive and and you know where you you definitely look back and you're you wonder to yourself, my gosh, how did you get into that? So it it's so relatable. For so many people. And I and I also want to extend this across the board, not just for women, right? There are men out there that Rita Cartwright: Right. Dr. Carmela Maxell: that experience this as well. and we want to just bring the humanness back to this. And and this is not about blame, but rather just the experience and understanding, man, what when we see these signs, how can we help our younger folks? How can we help people, you know, that are on that search? And so when you look back now. What are some of those warning signs that maybe you didn't recognize at the time? Rita Cartwright: Insecurity. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Mm. What did that look like? Rita Cartwright: Insecurity because i you know if I were raised with my dad being in my life, I I I assume that element of my life would have taught me about insecurity versus being secured. because daddies, good daddies teach daughters how to be strong and confident and and have that security within themselves. But as I look back, the common thread, because like I said, I went through it twice, the common thread was insecurity. And Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: that insecurity led to jealousy. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Rita Cartwright: Those are warning signs. Those are warning signs. And in my situation I had my first child when I was 16. Like I said, I was looking for love in all the wrong places. And so I had other what they always talk about, baby daddy, mama, baby daddy. I had that the daddy babies, baby daddies. I had baby daddies. Baby Dr. Carmela Maxell: Baby daddy. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: daddies. And so did these incidents, well one of them And we may discuss that further and it and it's in my book as well. And we'll talk about that. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Yes we will. Rita Cartwright: but this the second one was more intense, the relationship so much as the violence. He was very jealous about my son's dads coming to visit them and spend time with them. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: That is being insecured within yourself. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: where you're thinking that their dads are a threat to our relationship. So to answer Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: your question, I think and this is for the younger people as well, if he is insecure to himself, if he tends to be insanely jealous, those are red flags. Don't step Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. And I Rita Cartwright: around. Dr. Carmela Maxell: yeah, you know, and I think that there is like from a clinical perspective, right? feeling feeling those those feelings of, you know, I'm not sure about this. And you know, whenever there is someone new that comes into the picture, asking questions and having a a a a curiosity is one thing, right? So if it's so help me understand the relationship between that you and your ex have and how this folds with with your children. That's one thing. I think there, you know, there's there's some there's some value in in asking those questions. I think then Rita Cartwright: Right. Dr. Carmela Maxell: when it does become, you know, controlling, when it does become I don't like that, I don't want you to do that. I think you're you're you're spot on. Those are some red flags and Rita Cartwright: Yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: yes, I you know and It's very important to understand that the relationship is is is important, right? So if it with parents, and I and I don't just want to say men, but men and women, right? Can and this Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: can be interchangeable, the relationships with the children are important. If that if it's healthy, if it's if it's thriving, if it's going well, that is extremely important. But to your point, if Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: it becomes a I don't like you around this person. I don't w what's the relationship there? And we're we're taking Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: the the focus off of the child and the relationship. That can be really dangerous. Yeah, that can be really dangerous. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: Children. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. You're absolutely spot on. It's about and and and have this conversation because there's a lot of blended families now. Dr. Carmela Maxell: I am a I'm a yes. Yep. My experience. My me and my children, we're we are b a blended family. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: And so you you're gonna have parents that's outside Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: of the relationship, but they're parents to your child, and you may be married to someone else. So it's Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: very important to be able to blend as a blended family, knowing that there's other people involved in this relationship so far as the children, if they are healthy relationships. for the children. And so the Dr. Carmela Maxell: Uh-huh. Rita Cartwright: focus has has to remain on what's best for the child and not be thinking i and I just thought of another characteristic Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: trait that may be a red flag. Being so selfish, thinking only about yourself. You can't Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Mm. Rita Cartwright: think beyond yourself. You can't Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: think what's best for the child. You can't think what's best for this home. What's best for this family is all about you, Boo? Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you know, and I always play play devil's advocate, right? 'cause I I always I I don't want people thinking, gosh, so I'm I'm trying to I'm trying to engage in self-care. Self-care is something completely different. That is something completely different. But when you are wholly driven to only think about yourself and not think about how your actions may affect others. That's different, right? I think self-care is important. When you say, I need to take a break, I need to step away. I think in that Rita Cartwright: Right, right. Dr. Carmela Maxell: moment it's it's okay to be self-ish, but not selfish. Rita Cartwright: Right. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Right? Two completely different things. But but Rita Cartwright: Right. Dr. Carmela Maxell: yeah, when you're when you're linearly focused on yourself and Rita Cartwright: On yourself. Dr. Carmela Maxell: and it's just like everyone needs to cater to me. yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: Something is wrong with them, and like you said, it's a different with self-care because generally, as women, as caretakers, as moms, we do self-care in order to refuel our tank so we can be better for you. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think it's a lost yeah, it is. Rita Cartwright: And so that's different. That's different than just being solely, you know, solely and that is not when it's when the Bible says God is a jealous God, i he talking about you serving other gods, you know, rather than himself. That's a different kind of jealousy. That's not a unhealthy type of jealousy. That's for our good to only serve him. And not Dr. Carmela Maxell: Right. Rita Cartwright: false gods. And so that's a different type of jealousy, but when it's a unhe and note that I said insanely jealous. Where you can't even glance at another person without being accused of sleeping with that person. I went through that. Dr. Carmela Maxell: that is the that is an element of control and you know, we could get into the gaslighting and the love bombing and the bread crumbing and all of those terms that are so I think so just kind of circulated through our society now. But for for folks that maybe don't have that verbiage, right? Let's let's start here. Why do you think abuse so often begins with what appears to be love? Rita Cartwright: Because they have game. They're a charm. They're There there's and and like a woman in my position that is starving for love from a man, it's easy to misinterpret what love is. Someone paying you attention, giving you that attention that you never had from a man. Like I said, my mom did very well. And and and I come to learn that children need mother and father. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes that Rita Cartwright: if both of them are good because there's a balance there. Mom can only be my mom. She could not be my dad. And and we have to be that. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Right. Although many of us have to play multiple parts. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: Exactly. But there's still something lacking because only a man can teach the you know a boy how to be a man. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: And we teach the girls how to be a woman but Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: still They need both sets of parents, both sets of instilling values and and Dr. Carmela Maxell: Right. Rita Cartwright: characters and and and things of that nature from both sets of parents in a balanced way. And so Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: my mom, I said all that to say that my mom couldn't be the love that I needed from a man. She provided Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. And Rita Cartwright: the love as a as a mom. And so Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: to answer your question. the i i it's how well it appears to be love, are you the type of person like me who was starving for love, that's Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: seeking love in all the wrong place. But like us they can be charming, y'all. Dr. Carmela Maxell: I think yeah, I think it does pull on, you know, it it can, because I I try not to be exhaustive, but I'm also gonna speak from my own experience. You know, w when there is something that's lacking, or we get that the grass may be greener on the other side type deal. Right? That's another one. That's another one where I th Rita Cartwright: yes, yes, yes, yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: I think we ch we we as humans, I think they're part of our problem is that we always want more, more than we have. Rita Cartwright: Yes Dr. Carmela Maxell: We want more than we have. And that's not Rita Cartwright: Yes Yes Dr. Carmela Maxell: necessarily a bad thing, but in certain, you know, situations, certain arenas, if we're not careful, we can attract the thing we think we want. You know, and I've been in that situation where I'm like, man, it looked like love, it smelt like love, it tasted like Rita Cartwright: Right. Dr. Carmela Maxell: love, and then later on it was just like, it okay, that was actually Rita Cartwright: Hello. Dr. Carmela Maxell: that was actually that clearance rack nonsense. I should have stayed away. I should have stayed away. Yeah. Yeah. And we end up sacrificing so much of ourselves for what we think we know. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: Think. No, you know. And all humans need to be loved. I don't care what color we are, what ethnicity Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes, yes. Rita Cartwright: we are. That's one of those Maslow hierarchy. That's it. And so we all Dr. Carmela Maxell: Hierarchy of needs, yes. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: we all need the same basic things. And love Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: happens to be one of those basic things that we need. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: And it's like they know how to come at you. Being so charming and and and and they're deceitful. It's deceiving. And Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: and you come up, you know, a little country girl like me coming up and with no guidance from a man as to what to look out for in a man, Dr. Carmela Maxell: Right. Right. Rita Cartwright: you could easily end up in in that type of trap. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Right. Rita Cartwright: Yeah, like my grandmother used to call it a a lion's den. She Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: called it a lion's den, so Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And I think that we you know, when it comes to love. Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: I don't know that we're such a big abstract concept, right? Rita Cartwright: Yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: The way in which we define it, much of the time, I think, and Rita Cartwright: Yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: this is just my my thoughts about as I've thought about it over the you know the my years of existence, it is a mixture of what we have seen and experienced versus what Rita Cartwright: Mm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: we believe the ideal is. And so we don't necessarily have Rita Cartwright: Yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: A universal definition of love. We have for those of us, you know, who believe in God, we have the biblical version of love. For those of us Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: who you know don't believe in in God, we have, you know, maybe a spiritual version. Maybe there's you know, other other things that sort of attract and help us define. But I think maybe that. also contributes to our issue, right? There is no universality with a lot of these big terms, even with hate. We don't really have a universal understanding or definition of hate. And so if we're going based off of what we think we know. Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Love is going to look different and e and but across the board we may have things that are sprinkled in there that are similar. But we we're all gonna have very different definitions of what love is. Love could be what you see versus what Rita Cartwright: What we yes if yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: you feel versus what you do. That can be really confusing. Rita Cartwright: And and you said something, Carmela, because it's like one of the things you said is what what you see. Like I said, I grew up in a single parent household. I didn't see how a couple are supposed to interact. I didn't see how a couple is supposed to interact with each other. I didn't see how the the the woman's role, the man's role in a relationship, this is all based on what I learned, what I thought was what it's supposed to be. And you're right, even in the Bible, I can't quote it now, but there are different types of love even in the Bible. And we Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: and and and they and and they and they relate to to our natural life. you have the agape love, which is unconditional. Is is what we have with our children and we should have with our spouse, but we don't. That's another conversation. And it's Dr. Carmela Maxell: Right. Right. Yep. Rita Cartwright: it's And then there's the filial love with the love that you have for your brother and your sister. And then Dr. Carmela Maxell: Your sister, yeah. Rita Cartwright: there's and then I can't think of the other love, but it's the love that I can't think of the the the name of it, the biblical name of it, but it's the love that you experience in at in a intimate relationship with a spouse. And so that's Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: dip there's different type of of a love and and You're right, and based on our experiences, we're gonna have different perspectives of what that looks like. I never had the role model growing up as to what a couple is supposed to look like. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Or a healthy one. Yeah. Yeah. yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: in a home or in a home a healthy yeah Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: so that can lead to that can lead to issues as well of not being a good judge of character Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: and it's like you said it would you believe that it is based on your own experiences background upbringing what you witness and your perspectives all of that come into play Dr. Carmela Maxell: what do healthy relationships look like? And what should they never require us to sacrifice? Rita Cartwright: A healthy relationship, I believe the way that it looks like is that we respect each other, the couple respect each other. that is that is highly important that that the couple respect each other for who the other person is and also now me being like a leader in the kingdom of God. even people like me, like a leader, need a type of partner that's going to give me space. I'm just gonna use myself as as an example, that gives me space to do what God has called me to do. And on the secular side it's still the same. that this other the spouse respect each other, giving each other that ability to do what their purpose is in life, even encourage that person to go after their dreams, support that person af while they're going after their dreams. If it's a mother and and she happened to be working as well, he pitches in and helps with the household duties where she doesn't have to come home to him with his feet kicked up on the coffee table Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: with the remote control. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Rita Cartwright: And so and on the spiritual side, Christ Jesus said that the husband is to love his wife like he loves the church. And so that takes that takes an and a concerted effort because we are human to be able to to treat that spouse in that respect, because he was Christ Jesus. I mean he was one hundred percent God and one hundred percent man. And who we're one hundred percent, well we're a spirit, but we're humans. It's so I what I would say a healthy relationship looks like is that you allow that person to be who they are and Dr. Carmela Maxell: huh. Rita Cartwright: the second part of your question is allow that person to be who they are. they shouldn't a woman especially, we tend to lose our identity. We can't we we put ourselves on a back burner. we don't discover ourselves and rediscover ourselves until we become empty nesters. And it shouldn't be like that. So we should be able to hold on to our identity, retain our identity, even while being a mother, while being a wife. So Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: the spouse, the husband, should never ask his wife. to give up who she truly is in order Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Rita Cartwright: to be his wife because he married her for who she is. So that shouldn't Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: change. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. And I want to make this distinction for those of you in the audience who are like, well, you know, but but what if the the you know this person showed up differently? Or, you know, there's there's several pieces. And I think this the focus of this conversation is, you know, when there is when there are abusive tendencies, when when someone is experiencing interpersonal violence or domestic violence in the home. The the authenticity, I think, is really what I'm hearing from you. You know, that a person is able to authentically be themselves. And if that person is authentically themselves and that doesn't jive with you, even if that person is a is a good person, just doesn't work for you, that's also okay. You know, that's also okay for you to to reassess the situation and say, you know what, authentically who you are just doesn't work for me. That just doesn't work for me. And and I think, you know, people. many people get lost in the trap too, even if there is not abuse or if there's not neglect or any of that relationship. Well, this person is a good person, so I should stay. I should try to make it work. I think that's also not being authentic and genuine to who you are, right? There are just some relationships I don't think work. Rita Cartwright: Well, everyone is not made for everyone. Everyone is not made for everyone. So that Dr. Carmela Maxell: No no right, right. Rita Cartwright: that that that that is a fair statement Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: because even if we're attracted to the person, that doesn't mean that person i is made for us. Because it did Dr. Carmela Maxell: And you know, I'm not everyone's cup of tea. That's all right. Rita Cartwright: I'm not everyone's cup of tea and and the and and and and the the potential candidates are or you know, they're not we are created for certain type of people. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: And on the spiritual side, my lesson that I have learned all of these years is to let God select a person for me. Because and I know that that is a very deep spiritual thing to say. But God knows who the right person is for you. And like me in the leadership type of position, I'm a widow now. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Rita Cartwright: So I'm single again. And whoever whomever God selects for me will be a type of person who will catapult me. into what God has called me to be will undergird me, will cover me with prayer and support me and give me that space to be who God called me to be. And so that's on the spiritual side, but even on the natural side, women, we tend to have a a built in sensor, so to speak, where Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: we have intuition. about a person. So don't just stay with the person because they're kind and nice and and and and they're respectful and things like that. But certain chemistry just don't mix. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah, that gift of intuition, you know, there that that book is amazing. And and Rita Cartwright: Yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: a lot of times we do ignore that, right? For the for what we think might be the betterment of the relationship. And and ultimately for many of us, for for some of us, many of us, it could be the demise, right? Whether a person is is being abusive, if a person is is not treating us well, or they are treating us well, but it just doesn't drive with us. When we ignore that intuition, we do ourselves a disservice. We really do. Rita Cartwright: Right, because you're going to lose who you are. How how are you gonna stay Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: true to yourself? Because you're trying to fit a what does it say, a circle into a square peg. Yeah, it's not gonna work. That puzzle piece is just Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. It's not gonna work. Rita Cartwright: not going to fit, like I said. Everyone's chemistry is I mean the chemistry has to match. It has to match. And i Dr. Carmela Maxell: It's not meant for yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: it like I said at the risk of repeating myself, you're gonna lose who you are trying to fit into that relationship. And that's that Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. And you know what? Rita Cartwright: that that's gonna cause problems down the road. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. You know, I love your circle, peg, square, hole, what whichever way that you said it. but Rita Cartwright: Yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: but and I and I hear this often. My best friend and I have this conversation and she's like, Yeah, you can't you can't do that. And and I think to myself, man, I've witnessed so many relationships. I too have put myself in this position and I had I Rita Cartwright: Yeah, I guess. Dr. Carmela Maxell: had a lot of work I had to do, right? When it came to okay, why do I keep making this choice? And I think. What we do is we take that that circular peg and then we shave off the edges, right? So this sort of segues into the other piece. So many people picture bruises when they hear the words domestic violence. But oftentimes the abuse starts long before that. And when you shave down that, you know, that circular peg and you try and fit into that square, there's those gaps, right? And I think of those gaps. the the forms of maybe abuse or neglect that we overlook and you mentioned insecurity earlier Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: and being selfish but what forms of abuse and do you think people overlook because i don't know if many people recognize some of the forms of abuse that they might be interacting with or engaging with sometimes, you know, depending on your your family of origin, depending on how it's defined culturally, there are some things where once again we don't necessarily have a unified definition of the spectrum of abuse, but there are some things that we I think can pretty maybe unanimously agree on. Like these are absolute no-nos, but what are some things you think people maybe overlook? Rita Cartwright: It can be financial abuse. It can be emotional or abuse. it can be What I'm trying to say, mental abuse. I mean, it can be abuse that's not actually physical. emotional Dr. Carmela Maxell: Right. Rita Cartwright: abuse could be involving someone trying to control you, but not necessarily beating on you. And so it's all of that type of abuse. So I think some people the the main one I think that people tend to overlook or may not recognize is emotional abuse. they may think or they may come up in a household where if they think it's okay to treat a person that way emotionally. It's okay to talk to that person that way. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Well. Rita Cartwright: and emotional abuse lacks respect. Go back it goes back to that word respect. When a couple truly respect each other, these type of things will not enter into the relationship. But if that person Dr. Carmela Maxell: Well why? Rita Cartwright: has that type of nature where they are abusive in some type of form or fashion, it's still gonna come out. They're Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: not gonna be able to respect the other person because if a person is being abusive, to me they're not respecting themselves. Dr. Carmela Maxell: No, no. Rita Cartwright: Because it's it's like I how I heard Joyce Meyer once say, How can you give someone something you don't have? How can you love Dr. Carmela Maxell: Cap. Rita Cartwright: someone if you don't love yourself? How can you respect Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: someone if you don't respect yourself? How can you honor Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: someone if you don't honor yourself? You Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: can't give away what you don't have. But if it's a healthy relationship, respect honesty. These are the things that are important in a relationship. Can the person trust you? Because once that trust is broken. Dr. Carmela Maxell: It's hard to get back. Rita Cartwright: It is hard to get back. Dr. Carmela Maxell: It's hard to get back. You know, this is a question that I often get as a as a mental health professional. And I definitely would love to hear your take on this. So, you know, we we talk about, I think, this transactional relationship, right, between the the victim, the individual who's receiving the abusive behaviors, and then the the abuser. And sometimes those lines are not clean. And I get the question, well, do all abusers know that they're abusers? And my answer is no. I don't think that everyone knows that they're abusive. I think there's a lot of work, right, that that needs to go into that. There needs to be recognition. there has to be honest discussions and there has to be reception from, you know, from the person who was being abusive that perhaps their behaviors are not acceptable. Rita Cartwright: Normal. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah, well, yeah. Yeah. So what are your thoughts? I mean, I for me, I just working with clients and and and then also working with victims. I think that there are some victims that have also said, I don't I don't know that he recognized, I don't know that she recognized, I don't know that they recognized Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: that that they were abusive but part of it is what happens when I call them out. Oof. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: If they grew up in a household like that, where they think that is normal. then they don't see anything wrong with it. So it can be learned behavior however they learned it from somewhere. And if they that's why it's very important for young ladies if they had a a a healthy relationship with their with their father, he would teach her that this is not normal. If she come up in an abusive type of relationship and she doesn't see her mom doing anything different or re keep receiving it, she may think it's normal. The son Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: may think it's normal behavior. All of this is learned behavior. We're you know, like for example, babies are colorblind blind, children, toddlers or preschoolers are colorblind. until they're taught racism and and y d all of that type Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: of stuff. And it's a type of household environment that the person was reared in, that grew up in, where they see that as normal behavior. So they wouldn't know that there's nothing wrong with that. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: Sometime a person is fortunate enough, even if they came up in that type of environment, to recognize no, something not right with this picture. But Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: they're fortunate enough to learn that. But wonder if they grew up at the risk of repeating myself in that household and everyone treated like normal. It's a normal thing Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: to to do. And so that's why I Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: I mentioned earlier it's very important for the sons and daughters to have both parents in their lives, even if the parents are no longer together, they need they need both parents to pour into them. Because like I said, daddy would say, no, that's to the daughter, no, that's not the way a man should treat the woman. He tells his son, no son, that's that's it's not right to be abusive towards your spouse or your significant Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Yeah. Which means Rita Cartwright: or whomever. Dr. Carmela Maxell: you know, I I think about community and I've talked about this in several episodes with a few people, the importance of community, right? So Rita Cartwright: Yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: realistically, I think I want to shift away from ideals for a second, like the the the mom and dad household or and I wanna expand this like to to those of my my friends in in Like the LGBTQ plus community and and marginalized groups, you know, mom and mom or dad and dad. Who whomever is loving and and and responsible for and caring for for these these children, because I I don't want to leave anyone out, because the truth is domestic violence does not know a name. It does not know a person, it does not, it does not discriminate in, you know, in relationships, although we have seen examples of certain groups that have experience this more than others and I think particularly with with women, right? I want to be very protective of of our women here. But what do you say for for those like, you know, for for myself, I have a I have a great community, I have a great support system. I'm a single mom. But Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: what about the single moms or the single dads that don't have that other parent? even like they're not in the picture at all. And so we don't have that. how can they Help their children. How can they help raise their children to understand the best way to navigate and move through the world in a healthy way? Maybe like as a as a single mom or a single dad, you experience that abuse, but and you're on your own, and Rita Cartwright: Mm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: you don't have that other parent. What do you do? How can you how can we be and I wanna speak like I said, I wanna speak to those out there that are like, I hear you, Miss Rita. I hear you, Dr. Maxwell but I don't Rita Cartwright: Mm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: have I don't have anybody. I don't have another person. Daddy's gone, mom is gone. I don't have anybody and I'm and I'm Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: I'm coming out of a D V situation and I still Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: have I'm still responsible for these kids. Rita Cartwright: Well you mentioned community and community is important in that aspect and don't try to do it alone. There's support groups, Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Rita Cartwright: there's all types of resources where none of us have have to walk this road alone. And so community is very important. I have community of friends. of course family and I have my church family and going through the losses that I went through losing my husband five years ago last week marked five years and then a year later I lost my oldest son. That was a lot to endure in a short amount of time. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Rita Cartwright: my church was is my community and of course I have my family but it's important to be involved in a community and I don't want to sound like holier than than Dao but God did not make us to be alone. He made Dr. Carmela Maxell: No, no. Rita Cartwright: us need each other. There's Dr. Carmela Maxell: To connect. Rita Cartwright: go ahead. Good Dr. Carmela Maxell: No, to connect. I agree. Yeah, I agree. I agree. Rita Cartwright: Yes. It's c and and and community is is very important. And we were speaking about earlier, I don't know if we were on camera or not, about the evil forces. There are Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: evil forces in in the world that would try to isolate you. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: And that is detrimental Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Rita Cartwright: for you and and and whomever you may be caring for if you happen to be caring for children. And when Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: I when I speak on on respect and love and honor and that that that's that's universal. It doesn't matter if it's heterosexual or that type of relationship or you know, that it's a a a gay couple. It doesn't matter. You know, just like my book, How to Heal Your Broken Heart, I I geared it towards women, but that's universal. How would Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah, yeah. Rita Cartwright: I teach you how to heal your broken heart? That applies to to to male as well. And so, Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: anyways, back to your question, community is very important. Do not try to do it alone. When I was going through domestic violence, I turned 72. in June the last day of June. Anyone watching my birthday June 30th? You all can always send me a Cash App. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Have it asked. Rita Cartwright: Mark it on your calendar next year. This is Rita's birthday. Let me get her cash app handle something. Yes. Hallelujah. Praise the Lord. Dr. Carmela Maxell: We we got we all us roots, we got you. We got Rita Cartwright: Yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: you. Rita Cartwright: so well said is that I went through that approximately 50 years ago. I was in 20, I was 19 years old and I was 20. that like I said it happened back to back, the relationships. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Ooh. Rita Cartwright: And I was in a small town. I didn't have we didn't have support groups like there are now. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: We didn't have the resources available like they are available now. Do not try to walk this walk alone. It's detrimental not only Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: to you and it's detrimental to whomever you may be caring for. That is a selfish act if you try to do it alone. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. And and you know, I'll Yeah. I and I'll tell you Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: tap into your community. And you. And you. You know, you gotta help like that's why I said resources. You have people you can talk to. You have, if you need to go see a therapist, go see a therapist. Even church people go see it there. My pastors Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Rita Cartwright: say, take a pill and pray. If the doctor If the doctor has prescribed you to be on some type of medication, he said, don't stop taking the pill. Take the pill and pray. Dr. Carmela Maxell: No. Take the pill and pray. I like that. That's gonna be the tagline for the show. I love Rita Cartwright: Take the film and pray. And so you know, Dr. Carmela Maxell: man. Rita Cartwright: we're not advocating not because in the old school, in the old church, they did not support that. They did not suggest that. You know, pray about it, pray about it, pray about it, you know. You and that's what I was gonna say. And that's what I was Dr. Carmela Maxell: But you gotta do about it. You gotta do about it. You gotta do about it. You gotta do about it. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: gonna say. That's another thing that my pastor teaches us you prayer is not the actual solution prayer gives you the solution so you pray about Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: it give god time enough to respond because it's not a monologue is a dialogue and so even if you Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Rita Cartwright: even if you're in a secular world and don't believe in God there are still resources and support groups doctors Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: Therapists that are available to help Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: you walk this walk. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. And you know, we even say as as mental health professionals, right? So switching to, you know, as as we call it the secular side, right? Because I mean, there are folks who are spiritual but don't believe in God. They're, you know, and there's all different kinds of constellations of of people. And I want this to hit everybody. This this message applies to everybody, right? As met as mental Rita Cartwright: Yes. Everyone, yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: health professionals, what we also say is, right, it's mental health therapy and medication, right? For if it's appropriate, if medication is appropriate. But but Rita Cartwright: Right, right, right, right, right. Dr. Carmela Maxell: what we've seen in the research is that, you know, just the pill alone, just the medication alone, without the behavioral aspect, right? And so I I look at it like prayer should not be without work. This is not a I'm just gonna think it and I'm just gonna leave it up. It's also You don't rest on your laurels. You don't sit back, right? You don't expect that you get that job and you and and you prey on it, but you don't apply. Like what we doing? What Rita Cartwright: Right. Right. Dr. Carmela Maxell: are we doing? What are we doing? You gotta apply for the job. Rita Cartwright: Faith faith without works. Wait, wait, wait. Faith without works is dead? Dr. Carmela Maxell: It's dead. Yes. Yes. Yes. And I think this message applies. Right. And and we I think when it comes to community too, we also have to teach our folks about discernment. Because if we can restart this cycle, we can restart this cycle, right? So, okay. So so we get to the place where we're like, okay, all right, Miss Rita. Okay, Dr. Maxwell, I'm I'm not gonna do this alone. We gotta be careful who we allow. into our community. We can't we also gotta be I I believe in energy work and and the energy that we put out can be the energy that we attract. And we don't always know the energy that we put out. right? And and so I say be careful That you are not attracting some of the same stuff that happened to you. And so, my question for you is you said it happened back to back. How did you change your energy? How did you break that pattern? How did you get that community that was healthy, that was loving, that was stable, that was the complete antithesis to the abuse that you experienced? How did you start your journey to becoming Whole again. Rita Cartwright: Well Again, this is going to be on the spiritual side. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: I I may have mentioned that I was raised in church. However, I left the church. I left the church. And after I left the second abuser, my first abuse abuser, he was murdered. So that's how I was delivered out of that relationship. The second Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: abuser I actually left. And that's another topic because it was not an easy exit. Almost lost my life leaving. So I'm Dr. Carmela Maxell: Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Rita Cartwright: not saying it just is you know it's not easy. It i it's not it's easier said Dr. Carmela Maxell: It's not easy, but it's not easy. Rita Cartwright: than done, you know. It's not easy because he did come after after me. But what I was gonna say after I left that relationship, I returned back to my relationship with God. And that started Dr. Carmela Maxell: Uh-huh. Rita Cartwright: rebuilding my life. And I've been on that path ever since. For for the Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: last fifty years. I've been on that path. I even talk about it in my book, How Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: to Heal the Broken Heart. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Rita Cartwright: I talked about how when I left my second abuser that I did reestablish my relationship with God. And so with the Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm, uh-huh. Rita Cartwright: secular world, women still have an intuition. For Dr. Carmela Maxell: Uh-huh. Rita Cartwright: the men, I can't really speak to the men of how you discern whether that's a healthy community or not. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: You're just gonna have to be vigilant and do your research. But for Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: women, we just have this built-in intuition where you recognize, mmm, Dr. Carmela Maxell: Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Rita Cartwright: that that's not mad and that's not mad. That's not Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: adding up correctly. Pay attention to those red flags. Because back to the spiritual side. God said he will give us a way out. Now the Bible says temptation in one translation. Another translation says trials and testings. Still, it's the same thing. I personally have been in situations and God gave me an exit and I didn't take it. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Mm. Rita Cartwright: I felt it. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: I felt it and I didn't take it. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Why do you think you didn't? Rita Cartwright: I I cannot answer that question. Honestly, I really cannot answer. Why do we push those instincts down? Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. You know, I I will say just collectively, things that I've heard and my own experiences, the time isn't right. Rita Cartwright: That's a good one. Dr. Carmela Maxell: and that's hard to say, right? Because Rita Cartwright: That's a good one. Dr. Carmela Maxell: In in many ways, time is like never is never on our side, right? And and at the same Rita Cartwright: Right. Dr. Carmela Maxell: time, all we have is is time. We one of my favorite movies, and now I'm blanking on it. Of course I'm blanking on it right now, but it's it's something to the effect, this line of of we validate the existence of time, right? So our mere presence validates the existence of time. And so We mi we in we in essence manipulate time and we we cre we've created time. We could call it by any other name. But when it when the timing isn't right, right? Because for many people, like yourself when you were talking about it, if you left at the wrong time, that is a risk, a huge risk to your life. And and I want to, you know, to Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: give a nod and and a lot of respect and and a heart for those who are trying to get out of abusive relationships and the timing is not right. if you you move in any direction and and that could be your life. Absolutely. For some people the time is not right. Because financially they're not in a space and they need a little more time to financially get to that place. So finances ain't right. the other part is just and I and I say this to my young girls as a mom of I I have a daughter, a a young daughter. We have in many ways lost the definition of self-respect. And this does not mean that this applies to everybody. It does not mean that we are out here doing things intentionally to to to be disrespectful towards ourselves, but we have lost what self-respect looks like. Right. I love our empowerment journey. And at the same time, sometimes I think there's a little bit of wielding we gotta do with all that power as women, where we we don't lose that that the core of who we are. And it has nothing to do with how we dress. It has nothing to do with being entrepreneurs. It has nothing to do with that. It's this idea that we stay in situations where people are not meeting us where we're at. Rita Cartwright: Hmm. So we lower our expectation, which lower our Dr. Carmela Maxell: And our standards. Rita Cartwright: self-respect for ourselves. Dr. Carmela Maxell: I've done it. I'm gonna raise my hand really high. I've done it because I didn't think I was worth it. I didn't think I was worth more than that. And but I Rita Cartwright: That's that's that's a good point. Dr. Carmela Maxell: I wouldn't say that aloud. I I'll say it now. You know, there's a lot of growth and healing. But I Rita Cartwright: But that's that's yeah, that's a good thing. Yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: didn't think I'm like, okay, some, you know, yeah, he's treated me this way, but I don't know that I deserve any better. I don't know if I'm gonna find Rita Cartwright: Hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: better. I'm I'm stuck in my own complacency. And it's just the God honest truth. It's just the truth. Rita Cartwright: Well, you know, as you as you were talking and I was answering my own self as to why I didn't take the exit out. I didn't want to at that time. And Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. That's fair. That that's that's fair. Rita Cartwright: and and and and I was like, it could be in a situation, I could think of a situation where I was just in too far and I didn't want to I didn't want to out of that. And and I'm not necessarily speaking of an abusive situation. I'm talking about any given situation. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes, yes, yes. Rita Cartwright: Any game not just abusive were and and I was so foreign I didn't want to stop. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Yeah. And that's an investment, right? That's an it yeah. Rita Cartwright: is and that's and so that's another one is time and whether or not you want to do you Dr. Carmela Maxell: huh. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: really want to and and and and the desire to is going to be based on do you feel worthy of better? Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That is actually one on the top, maybe top five of of of reasons that I've heard from both women and men and and and couples and relationships that they don't leave. I invested 20 years into this. I'm not going anywhere now. Rita Cartwright: Yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: You know, like I'm like, I hear you and you guys are fighting all the time and there's a lot going on. Rita Cartwright: Yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: But okay. Okay, you know, and no judgment or anything, but You've clearly told me that you're unhappy and you you no longer want to be with this person and da-da-da-da, or this person's abusive that I I've invested all this time. And and I I say this so often. Rita Cartwright: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: We never want to feel or think that we are making a bad investment. That's so human. It's so human. We don't ever want to feel like how would you Rita Cartwright: In the end. Dr. Carmela Maxell: feel if you said to someone, right? Like, yeah, I I made a bad investment. Yeah, I made a bad I ooh, I would just curl under my desk. Just curl under my desk. But the truth is I've made a series of bad investments. And and I had to grow from them. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And and and I'm not only a widow, I am a divorcee. I divorced my second husband after eighteen years of marriage. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: And that that's quite a quite an investment. And Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes it is. Rita Cartwright: it's like The thought, even like now, my my late husband and I, we were together 24 years. 24 Dr. Carmela Maxell: Well yeah. Rita Cartwright: years total, you know, living together and being married. We were married more years than living together, but it totaled 24 years. And I guess use me as an example. I'm out here again. Do I want to learn somebody else? Dr. Carmela Maxell: Ugh No, okay No Rita Cartwright: So these things these things run across your mind. Do I wanna Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: learn someone else? Do I wanna learn their idiosyncrasies? Do I do I wanna open up who I am to let someone into my space like that? This is like, you know, do I really wanna go there? It's it's so and it's like, Dr. Carmela Maxell: That's so real. That's Rita Cartwright: you know, and and the investment part, you you know the person. And we as humans we hate change. We just hate Dr. Carmela Maxell: We do. I mean it Rita Cartwright: change. Dr. Carmela Maxell: what do we call that? The devil you know? Because I I mean, I I won't even speak to dating and all of that. I think dating has its place, finding people has its place. I I believe in love, I believe in relationships. and at the same time, I'm the person who's like, I don't even want to post on social media. Like that's how basic I am. Rita Cartwright: He Dr. Carmela Maxell: if if I can't get there with like a graphic post, I'm just like the dating just seems overwhelming because the the trend. Is so different from even a few years ago, right? You're learning, first Rita Cartwright: Yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: of all, it's it's how we're dating now. Like everything is through apps and meeting people in in person is it's it's still out there, but it's very different. People's decorum is very different, people's demeanors are very different. And then on this subject, if you have experienced domestic violence, if you experienced abuse or neglect or anything like that. I think there's a shield that kind of goes up. Right? Where you're like, mmm Rita Cartwright: Yes! I knew my I knew my husband. Dr. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Uh-huh. Rita Cartwright: Carmela, I knew my husband and he was not abusive. He was loving. I knew him. And it's like I knew his idiosyncrasies. I had became adapted to it. And it's so it's like all of that to consider. And being that I have dealt with abusive relationships in the past, that is something I am very, very mindful about while Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: out here in in the single world again. That is that is something that makes me more ap apprehensive than anything else because. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Than anything else. Yep. Rita Cartwright: than anything else because and then you're hearing on the news every day where in a domestic violent relationship the the husband or boyfriend has killed his spouse his girlfriend and then turn around and kill themselves and so it's like even an incident where a young lady here met someone on the the through dating app she Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: went on her first date Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-mm. Mm. Rita Cartwright: And the guy killed her. He murdered her on their first date. So these are all Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Rita Cartwright: the type of things that that that I think about. So just use me as as an example. because if my husband was still alive, we would still be together. It it's like I wouldn't say the devil I I knew, but I knew him. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: I knew him. And so, yes, you're right. So, that may be a reason why a person stay where they are because. We do not like change. And I would say, and I know this is totally off subject Dr. Carmela Maxell: No, that's a Rita Cartwright: and it's a sidebar thing. America, Dr. Carmela Maxell: That's okay. Rita Cartwright: America, the United States of America cannot accept change. They want it to remain the same as back in the day. Dr. Carmela Maxell: even know what the same is anymore. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. The yeah. Rita Cartwright: You know, they want they they're they're doing everything now to re reverse the clock back to the way it was. They don't want to adapt to the change. And so I'm just using that as an example. We do not like change because we are put in a position to relearn. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Well change requires work and the problem with work Rita Cartwright: Change require work and anything worth having requires work. Don't just settle. Don't Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: settle. You have one life to live. You have one life to live. Do not settle. We all have paths. Whether you are a believer or not, I'm talking to the audience. Whether you are a believer or not, we all have paths that we Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: are to. to walk on. And Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes, yes. Rita Cartwright: if that person don't fit the path, you have to say, boy, bye. You have to keep it moving. And it's hard. It's hard. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. And I think this this applies this applies to friendships too. I want to put it out there because there are abusive friendships. it Rita Cartwright: Yes, that's toxin. Dr. Carmela Maxell: yes, very toxic. And and if those individuals and you know, I had to do a lot of regrouping and and thinking over the course of my life. Like who I I said earlier, you know, we have to be careful and be and exercise discernment when it comes to our communities, otherwise we will repeat. We can repeat some of these same mistakes. But if there are people, not just your significant other, if there are people that are just not aligned with your path, aligned with your values, for some of them, it doesn't make them bad people. I don't I don't like to qualify people in this way. These people are just not for me. These people are not for me. But if they are not aligned with your path, why are you trying so hard to put on a sweater that doesn't fit? Rita Cartwright: Just to be long, just to be long. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Woo! Woo! Rita Cartwright: No, no, no, no. Dr. Carmela Maxell: It's exhausting. It's exhausting. Rita Cartwright: Because once you align yourself with the path you're supposed to be on, life will become very joyful. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: The flow will be easier. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: You're still gonna have situations and you're still gonna have issues. However, some of those issues can be eliminated and some of those we bring on ourselves because we get off Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Rita Cartwright: the path that we're supposed to be on. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: So don't force a a round peg into a square hole. I Dr. Carmela Maxell: No. Rita Cartwright: r you know, even as a child, a teenager, I remember that. I always stuck out. I you know, I look back now, always stuck out. because I was trying to fit into the wrong crowd. And so I I Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah, I had the same issue. Rita Cartwright: I had it And and I know what it feels like to try to force yourself to fit into that square peg. I know what it feels like. And and and and back to what I was saying earlier, you lose who you are trying to fit. You're trying to become a square and you're a si circle. You're a cylinder trying to fit it, Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: and you're not that square. You're a cylinder. And we're all Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: are made for particular reasons, specific reasons, specific task. that's why all of our fingerprints are different, even twins' fingerprints Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Rita Cartwright: are different. There's no two Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: fingerprints alike. We're all unique in our own ways. And And there's a purpose for that. There's a purpose for your uniqueness. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: Don't cast your pearls in front of swines. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Swine. Yes. Yes. Yes. You know, this brings me to a couple of my final questions here, because this is great. Rita Cartwright: Yeah. Dr. Carmela Maxell: So so you've gone through all of this, right? You get out of this relationship, you realize that maybe because I I don't want to I don't want to victim blame, but rather maybe there was a s a cycle that you didn't see, right? If you keep getting into these serial relationships like this. And I experienced that. Throw myself out there, I experienced that. Healing begins from within, But Rita Cartwright: Yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: leaving doesn't mean that the trauma ends. And I think that is where people I think get can can get a little complacent, right? So yes, you leave a situation that is abusive and that is horrible for you and for your children. Sometimes healing begins after the danger is passed. And there's there's a psychological, I think, time period, right? We talked about you rebuilding and getting back into church and having your community, but how do people recognize when they're starting to heal? Especially after this. Rita Cartwright: You know, for me personally it's because I can talk about it and Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Rita Cartwright: I I I am using my experience outside of myself. in other words, I am helping other women to rebuild. I wouldn't be able to give healing if I haven't experienced healing. Ooh wow Holy Spirit, that was powerful. I wouldn't be able to give out how to heal if I haven't experienced healing myself. And we talked about this earlier and I don't think we were on live yet, but there's a what you call nervous system reset if I'm saying it correctly Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Mm-hmm. policing yourself. Yeah, Rita Cartwright: yes Dr. Carmela Maxell: yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: that but that that's a sign that you need to realign reset or you know you you you you feel like you're still in that danger when when the garage open it's him coming home you know and it you know these type of triggers so if these these triggers are setting you off there's still some alignment that still needs to happen your body and your nervous system your your your your your your mind your soul which consists of your soul consists of your mind your emotions and always forget the what the third one is but when you're out of alignment you're you feel like you still danger danger you still feel like you're in that that that zone you know, where even if you hear someone speak loudly, ha it'll yell at someone, does that set you off? Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: do do those things still affect you? If those things still affect you, there's some healing that still needs to take place. There's a realignment that still needs to take place. But please don't try to do it by yourself. Dr. Carmela Maxell: And you shouldn't and I I want to make sure that in the the show notes I am going to also be giving out resources for individuals experiencing domestic violence or if you know someone who is experiencing domestic Rita Cartwright: Yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: violence who may or may not be able to talk about it. I I want that to place that information in in the the notes. Rita Cartwright: Yes, Dr. Carmela Maxell: We absolutely want to support this community as much as we we can. And we know that we have Rita Cartwright: Yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: to do it together. We have to do this together. Rita Cartwright: God gave me this assignment. And it wasn't just for me, it's for women. it. This is his book. This this book is as a result of a prophecy. A prophet Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: told me, I see you writing a book that's going to help women with broken hearts to heal. And I Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Rita Cartwright: my response, but I said, but I don't like to write. He said, You're going to write. He said, You're going to write. So here it is. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Let me let me tell you, when you are so moved, yes, when you are so moved to do it, man, I same thing happened to me. I want to hold that book back up again. Hold that book up because let's talk about this. tell us a little bit like a like the the elevator pitch to your book. Let us let our audience know where they can find it. I'm also going to be putting Miss Rita's information, her website, link to the book as well, and her website onto the show notes. Tell us about this book. Tell us about just the writing behind it. And I know you said, you know, I don't like to write, listen. I don't like to write when I'm told to write. So I'm with you. Rita Cartwright: Well, my book consists of, and like I said, is is on how to heal your broken heart. And so I am very transparent in my book Dr. Carmela Maxell: We like that. Rita Cartwright: to the point to the point where it can be embarrassing, right? And so my first story, I wrote three stories, and my first story is on domestic violence and the two relationships. That I endured. And there are stories within stories because there are stories within that domestic violent relationship. and my second story is on infidelity. This is the husband that I left after 17 years, my daughter's father. and in that situation, y'all, I wanted to start over. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Rita Cartwright: I didn't want to stay in that situation. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: And the third story is on losing loved ones. even while I was in the midst of writing my book, I was on the chapter of losing loved ones when my son died. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Mm. Rita Cartwright: So I edited that chapter to add my son in. And so that happened while I was writing Losing Loved Ones. And then Dr. Carmela Maxell: Wow. Wow. Rita Cartwright: the second section is on eight biblical principles. And these are based on scriptures. So it's for those who are Christians, who have faith. and like I said, for those who don't believe in God, there are resources, there are groups, support groups. can still help you. But in my book, if they these b biblical principles are based on scripture. And you have to have faith in order for the principles to work. I apply these same eight biblical principles to my personal life and I can say they work. Because I am healed. I am healed. By the grace of God, I am healed. And when I speak of I do blah blah blah, God sent me to the women, blah blah blah. It's not me doing it. Like I said, it's not me doing it. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: I can't do anything without God. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: But with God, all things are possible, even healing. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm. Rita Cartwright: through that type of loss because when my husband got sick, I was still mourning the loss of my mom. Dr. Carmela Maxell: my yeah. Rita Cartwright: And so I I I went through a d a dark season there. And now I'm here being able to talk about it and help others who Perhaps are experiencing the same thing or have experienced the same thing. So, in a nutshell, that's what my book is about. It's about the three stories that broke my heart and eight biblical principles that would help you to heal. So it's a personal story, but it's sort of like a self help book as well. But you Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah, yeah. Rita Cartwright: have to apply the principles with faith. There's a scripture in the Bible where God said. He sent his word and it healed them. So there's healing power in the word of God. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. And we know just in general the power of words, just in general. Yeah. Yeah. Rita Cartwright: Yes. Because we we're talking about even even in an emotional abusive situation, that's words that person is using to cut you up and down. Dr. Carmela Maxell: They're pe they can penetrate deeply, very, very deeply. Yeah. Yes. Rita Cartwright: It can penetrate deeply. And back to the Bible, there's a scripture Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: that said there's power of life and death in our tongues. Dr. Carmela Maxell: In the tongue. Mm-hmm. Yes. Rita Cartwright: Our tongues, the smallest organ that we have, and it can co create the largest amount of damage. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Be got to be careful how we speak to people and our, you know, those perceptions of people. And I say this for all individuals who maybe experiencing domestic violence and interpersonal violence. We are with you. We, you know, we are we are here to support. my hope, and my hope has always been with this podcast that we connect and not divide. And I'm so I'm absolutely blessed, Miss Rita, to have had you on today. And I hope that people take what they need from this and that they they also utilize you. please check out Miss Rita's website and where can we purchase your your book? Rita Cartwright: The link that you're going to provide is the link to my publisher. And that's Dr. Carmela Maxell: Okay. Rita Cartwright: where you order your books. Unless you live in Dr. Carmela Maxell: All right. Rita Cartwright: Phoenix, you can we can meet for coffee and tea and I can hand it to you. Dr. Carmela Maxell: I'm a little Yes, Phoenix, you know what? Well re reach out to Miss Rita. I'm all the way here in Washington, so I can't walk to you. can't walk to you, but perhaps Rita Cartwright: No no. We we can't meet we can't meet at Starbucks. We Dr. Carmela Maxell: Hand me the Starbucks. I'll see you I'll see you on Zoom. I'll see you on Zoom. What the Rita Cartwright: No, no. So look for the link in the show notes of how and these links Dr. Carmela Maxell: Absolutely. Rita Cartwright: go directly to my publisher. And there's also a international link that you will provide and for the audience who may be international and that link is to Amazon. That's to Amazon. and so but for the Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Yes. Okay. So got a couple different routes. Rita Cartwright: ones in the US, the one in the US, please utilize my publisher. The ones out Dr. Carmela Maxell: Absolutely. Rita Cartwright: of state, out of the country rather, Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: you can order directly from Amazon. And that link will be provided as well. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes, it will. Yes, it will. Miss Rita, you have been an absolute joy, inspiration, and you know, for Rita Cartwright: God bless. Dr. Carmela Maxell: God bless. I mean this for for girls, for for our girls, for our women, for the state of being, for all of humankind. I hope that people take something from this message today, they apply it, they find those Communities that can help them with their healing, that they find that therapist, they find that doctor, they find that provider, they find that spiritual leader, they find this message and they Rita Cartwright: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: grow and go. And I I I'm gonna say this one more time as my disclaimer for anyone who is experiencing interpersonal violence, domestic violence at home, or any other situation, please You know, contact your local law enforcement. I will be placing some resources in the show notes, therapy resources as well, and some resources for for communities to find one another, because we should not be doing this alone. We've got to do this and help each other out because that is what we're built for. We were built to connect with one another. Yes, yes, yes. Rita Cartwright: Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. And like I said, God is using me to help his daughters in that situation and those that come out of that situation. And and not to cut you off, but there weren't even shelters available when I went through that. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: There were no shelters and today you all y'all have the resources. Take advantage of it. You do not have to stay there. And and and let me let me speak to the young people for a quick second here. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Mm-hmm. Rita Cartwright: That is not love you all. That is not because younger people I'm I'm learning that you all are seeing this as a form of love that that your significant other beat on you or or talk rough to you, treat you with disrespect, that's not that's not love. That is not love. If if he has to put his hands on you that way, that is not displaying a form of love that you deserve. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Right, right, right. And I think you put it so simply and so eloquently earlier, don't settle. Rita Cartwright: settle don't settle you have Dr. Carmela Maxell: You only have this one life. Rita Cartwright: you have an abundant life you have an abundant life planned for you and Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Rita Cartwright: you just got off track i got off track too y'all Dr. Carmela Maxell: Isn't life a series of tangents? I love it. I love it. I love it. Rita Cartwright: You know, so and don't demean yourself, don't down yourself, don't, don't what I'm trying to say, think bad about yourself. We all make mistakes, but there are Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. Rita Cartwright: mistakes to be fixed. Don't don't stay there. Don't stay there. We all make mistakes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yeah. Yeah. You know, I we do. And and and then we have people that put us down. And you know, the the rapper Cardi B, there's a song that she actually put out there that I I respect the lyrics here. She's like, you know, been down nine times, but I get up ten. Rita Cartwright: Hmm. Dr. Carmela Maxell: And right, so it's not about how you fall. But it's about how you rise. Rita Cartwright: Y exactly. And you are made to rise. You are made to rise. You have what it takes. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Absolutely how you rise. You're made to rise. We are rooted and rising. Rita Cartwright: Rising. Dr. Carmela Maxell: We are rooted and rising, folks. Rooted and rising. See what I did there? Rita Cartwright: do not cheat yourself out of do not cheat yourself out of the life that God has for you. Even if you don't believe in God, you you have a a life prepared Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes, yeah. Rita Cartwright: specifically for you. And it is full of joy, it is full of happiness, it is full of success, it is full of prosperity. Just get back on the right track. Dr. Carmela Maxell: Yes. And with that being said, my friends, thank you for s for sitting with us today and listening to this. please check the show notes for all this wonderful information. Miss Rita, you have been an absolute joy. And for the rest of you, stay rooted in who you are and keep rising into who you're becoming. Take care.